Mar 25, 2025 Planning and Zoning

MY NAME IS DESTINY WOODS.

I'M A PLANNER WITH THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT.

HERE YOU CAN SEE THE AERIAL VIEW OF THE LOCATION OF THIS REQUEST, AS WELL AS THE PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT SHOWN BY THIS GRAPHIC.

IN 1980, CENTRAL BUSINESS-1 WAS THE ZONING AND THEN IN 1998, PLANNED DEVELOPMENT-65-CENTRAL BUSINESS-1 WAS ESTABLISHED, AND IT ONLY INCLUDED TRACTS A AND B.

THEN IN 2005, APPROXIMATELY 18 ACRES WERE ADDED TO TRACT B ABOVE HEADQUARTERS DRIVE.

IN 2014, TRACTS C AND D WERE ADDED TO THE DISTRICT, AND IN 2022, THE OPEN SPACE REQUIREMENTS WERE MODIFIED.

THIS PROPOSAL WILL FOCUS ON TRACTS C AND D, ALTHOUGH THE ZONING IS FOR THE ENTIRE DISTRICT.

THE PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT WILL INCREASE THE USABLE OPEN SPACE AREA BY CLOSING WATER STREET, AND IT WILL DECREASE A SMALL AREA OF OPEN SPACE FOR A RETAIL KIOSK, WHICH WILL NOT BE USED FOR COMMERCIAL SIGNAGE.

THEN EIGHT SIGN KIOSKS WILL BE ADDED WITH THIS REQUEST, AS WELL AS FOUR LARGE DIGITAL SIGNS.

THOSE SIGNS WILL INCLUDE TWO SIGNS ON BUILDINGS FACING WINDROSE AVENUE, AND THEN TWO SIGNS ON GARAGES FACING WINDROSE AVENUE.

TO SUMMARIZE THE STIPULATIONS, THEY'RE BROKEN UP BETWEEN OPEN SPACE AND SIGNAGE.

THE OPEN SPACE AMENDMENTS WILL REQUIRE MINIMUM OPEN SPACE GOING FROM 8.7 ACRES OF OPEN SPACE TO 8.85 ACRES OF OPEN SPACE, AND THE MINIMUM REQUIREMENT WITHIN TRACT C AND D TO INCREASE FROM 1.6 ACRES TO 1.7 ACRES.

THE KIOSK AMENDMENTS WILL ALLOW FOR EIGHT TOTAL SIGN KIOSKS, AND THOSE KIOSKS MAY BE USED FOR ADVERTISING.

THEY MUST BE AT LEAST 75 FEET APART, AND THEY MUST BE WITHIN 50 FEET OF WINDROSE AVENUE.

THE SIGNAGE AMENDMENTS WILL ALLOW FOR TWO SIGNS ON THE PARKING GARAGE FACADES FACING EAST TOWARDS WINDROSE AVENUE.

FOR THOSE SIGNS, ONE WOULD BE WITHIN 300 FEET OF HEADQUARTERS.

THAT ONE IS ALLOWED TO BE 1,100 SQUARE FEET, AND THEN ONE IS OVER 300 FEET OF HEADQUARTERS DRIVE.

THAT ONE IS ALLOWED TO BE 1,500 SQUARE FEET.

THE SIGNS ON THE BUILDING FACADES FACING WINDROSE AVENUE, THE ONE ON THE EAST IS REQUIRED TO BE 400 SQUARE FEET.

ON THE WEST, IT'S REQUIRED TO BE 900 SQUARE FEET.

FOR THE CLOSURE OF WATER STREET, WATER STREET IS CURRENTLY A PRIVATELY OWNED QUASI PUBLIC STREET CONNECTING WINDROSE AVENUE TO COMMUNICATIONS PARKWAY WITHIN THE LEGACY WEST DEVELOPMENT.

THE WESTERN SEGMENT OF WATER STREET WILL REMAIN AS A PRIVATE DRIVEWAY WITH ACCESS TO AND THROUGH THE PARKING GARAGE FROM COMMUNICATIONS PARKWAY, AS WELL AS WINDROSE AVENUE.

AS A RESULT OF THIS CLOSURE, WATER STREET WILL NO LONGER FUNCTION AS A QUASI PUBLIC STREET, AND IT ALSO WILL NOT MEET FIRE LANE REQUIREMENTS OR STREET REQUIREMENTS.

ALL OF THE APARTMENTS AND BUSINESSES WITH A WATER STREET ADDRESS WILL BE READDRESSED TO COMMUNICATIONS PARKWAY,

[00:10:01]

AND WATER STREET WILL BE CONVERTED TO BE AN OUTDOOR STAGE AND CREATE 0.18 ACRES OF OPEN SPACE AREA.

THAT CONVERSION WILL ONLY TAKE PLACE ON THE EASTERN PORTION OF WHAT'S CURRENTLY WATER STREET.

FOR THE OPEN SPACE BY ADDING 0.18 ACRES OF OPEN SPACE THROUGH THE CLOSURE OF WATER STREET AND REMOVING 0.3 ACRES OF OPEN SPACE BY ADDING IN A RETAIL KIOSK, THERE'S A NET INCREASE OF 0.15 ACRES OF OPEN SPACE TO THE ENTIRE DISTRICT.

AS FAR AS THE KIOSK CHANGES.

THE CHANGES ARE TO TRACTS C AND D, AND THEY'RE PROPOSED WITH THE NEW DEVELOPMENT.

BUT TRACTS A AND B, THOSE WILL REMAIN WITH THE EXISTING REQUIREMENTS.

THOSE REQUIREMENTS INCLUDE FOUR TOTAL KIOSKS, AND THEY WILL HAVE NO ADVERTISING ON THOSE AND THAT IS NOT CHANGING IN THE STIPULATIONS.

AS FAR AS TRACTS C AND D, EIGHT TOTAL KIOSKS WILL BE PERMITTED.

THEY MAY BE USED FOR ADVERTISING, AND THEY'LL HAVE TO FOLLOW THE STIPULATION SET.

THIS MAP SHOWS THE LOCATIONS OF THOSE PROPOSED KIOSKS, AND THERE ARE EIGHT ARROWS HERE.

YOU CAN SEE THERE'S ONE DOT INSIDE OF A BUILDING THAT IS NOT GOING TO BE REGULATED BY THIS REQUEST.

FOR THE GARAGE SIGNAGE.

THERE ARE TWO SIGNS ON PARKING GARAGES, FACADES FACING EAST TOWARD WINDROSE.

THIS PICTURE ON THE TOP, YOU CAN SEE, IS A VIEW FROM WINTHROP STREET INTO THE DEVELOPMENT, AND IT'S SHOWING THAT GARAGE THAT WOULD HAVE THE LARGER SIGN ON IT, THAT 1,500 SQUARE FOOT SIGN.

THIS MAP SHOWS THE LOCATIONS OF THOSE SIGNS.

THE BUILDING SIGNAGE. THERE WILL BE TWO SIGNS ON TWO BUILDING FACADES FACING WINDROSE AVENUE.

EAST OF WINDROSE IS GOING TO BE 400 FEET.

THAT'S ON THE RIGHT PICTURE, AND WEST OF WINDROSE WILL BE 900 SQUARE FEET.

THIS MAP SHOWS WHERE THOSE SIGNS ARE.

ALL OF THE GARAGE BUILDING AND KIOSK SIGNS ARE REQUIRED TO BE FACING INTERNAL TO THE DEVELOPMENT, SIMILAR TO AN INDOOR SHOPPING MALL.

PD-65-CENTRAL BUSINESS-1 IS LOCATED WITHIN THE URBAN ACTIVITY CENTERS AND EMPLOYMENT CENTERS CATEGORIES OF THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP.

HOWEVER, CHANGES PROPOSED IN THIS ZONING CASE ARE LIMITED TO TRACT C, WHICH IS LOCATED EXCLUSIVELY IN THE UA CATEGORY.

THE REQUEST MEETS THE POLICIES SET BY THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

STAFF RECEIVED 10 TOTAL LETTERS WITHIN THE SUBJECT PROPERTY AND ZERO LETTERS WITHIN THE 200-FOOT BUFFER.

WE RECEIVED 18 TOTAL LETTERS AND ONLINE RESPONSES AND ONE EMAIL RESPONSE.

TO SUMMARIZE, THE PURPOSE OF THIS REQUEST IS TO REVISE THE OPEN SPACE PLAN TO PROVIDE A NET INCREASE OF 0.15 ACRES OF OPEN SPACE AND PROPOSED STANDARDS TO ALLOW EIGHT ADDITIONAL KIOSKS AND FOUR WALL SIGNS ORIENTED INWARD TO THE LEGACY WEST DEVELOPMENT.

THE DEVELOPMENT FUNCTIONS AS AN OPEN-AIR SHOPPING MALL WITH SHOPS AND SIGNAGE FACING AN OUTDOOR CORRIDOR SIMILAR TO A CENTRAL HALLWAY.

THIS REQUEST IS IN CONFORMANCE WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN RECOMMENDATIONS AND POLICIES.

STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF THE ZONING CASE AS SUBMITTED, AND STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL FOR THE SITE PLAN, SUBJECT TO CITY COUNCIL APPROVAL OF THE ZONING CASE.

I'M AVAILABLE FOR ANY QUESTIONS.

WE ALSO HAVE THE TRAFFIC ENGINEER MANAGER AVAILABLE FOR QUESTIONS AS WELL AS THE APPLICANT.

[00:15:01]

>> THANK YOU. ONE QUICK QUESTION FROM ME AND THEN I'LL TURN IT OVER TO THE COMMISSIONERS.

JUST FOR THE RECORD, PUBLIC SAFETY HAS SIGNED OFF ON THE CLOSURE OF THE STREET FOR FIRE AND POLICE.

>> THE FIRE DEPARTMENT HAS APPROVED A VARIANCE FOR THE CLOSURE OF THE STREET SINCE IT WOULDN'T MEET THE REQUIREMENTS WITHOUT ONE, AND ALL OF THE STAFF COMMENTS HAVE BEEN ADDRESSED FOR THIS CASE.

>> GREAT. MR. BELL.

>> JUST ONE QUICK CLARIFICATION ON THE SIGNAGE.

I THINK THE PRESENTATION MENTIONED THAT THE TWO SIGNS ON THE GARAGES WERE FACING EAST.

THEY'RE ACTUALLY ON THE EAST SIDE OF WATER STREET, BUT THEY'RE FACING WEST.

I'LL MAKE THAT CLARIFICATION.

>> COMMISSIONERS, TECHNICAL QUESTIONS FOR STAFF. COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF?

>> YES. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN.

ARE THERE APARTMENTS OR RESIDENCES FACING WATER STREET OR WINDROSE AVENUE?

>> THERE IS AN APARTMENT COMPLEX THAT IS ADDRESSED TO WATER STREET.

I'M NOT SURE IF THERE ARE WINDOWS THAT OVERLOOK WATER STREET.

I'M ASSUMING THAT THERE ARE, THOUGH.

>> I WOULD WANT THE APPLICANT TO CLARIFY THAT. THANK YOU.

>> COMMISSIONER OLLEY.

>> I THINK COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF HAVE ASKED ONE OF MY QUESTIONS.

>> BETTER? HERE WE GO. MOST OF THE LETTERS IN OPPOSITION SEEM TO BE REGARDING WATER STREET CLOSURE.

THAT'S A PRIVATELY OWNED STREET OWNED BY THE APPLICANT, I'M ASSUMING?

>> THAT'S CORRECT.

>> IT'S WITHIN THE APPLICANTS RIGHT.

AS LONG AS IT DOESN'T VIOLATE CITY ORDINANCES IF THEY WANT TO CLOSE IT OR NOT OR MAKE IT NO LONGER AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC?

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

>> SECOND QUESTION ON THE SIGNAGE.

ONE OF THE SIGNS IS VIEWABLE IF YOU'RE APPROACHING THE DEVELOPMENT FROM THE SOUTH JUST BEFORE YOU TURN IN.

IF YOU CAN GO BACK.

THE FIRST YELLOW ARROW, SIMILAR TO COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF, WOULD THERE BE ANY IMPACT TO ANY RESIDENTS AT NIGHT FOR THAT SIGN, IF YOU GO ACROSS THE STREET, WHICH IS MOST LIKELY MORE OFFICE COMPLEXES, BUT HAVE WE LOOKED AT CLEAR?

>> BOTH OF THOSE SIGNS FACE INTERNAL TO WINDROSE AVENUE.

ARE YOU ASKING IF THERE ARE APARTMENTS THAT WOULD BE ADJACENT TO?

>> THE FIRST ARROW, I THINK THAT SIGN WILL BE VIEWABLE IF YOU'RE ON THE STREET ABOUT TO TURN IT? IT'S LARGE ENOUGH AND HIGH ENOUGH.

>> THAT'S CORRECT. YOU'D BE ABLE TO SEE IT FROM LEGACY DRIVE.

>> LEGACY DRIVE?

>> IT'S ON CURRENTLY THE EARLS RESTAURANT AND BE FACING SOUTH TOWARDS LEGACY. THAT'S CORRECT.

THERE ARE NO RESIDENTIAL UNITS ON THAT SIDE THAT THAT WOULD FACE THAT SIGN.

TO ANSWER MR. BROUNOFF QUESTION AND YOURS, THERE ARE RESIDENTIAL UNITS FACING WATER STREET AND WINDROSE, SO THOSE SIGNS WOULD BE VISIBLE, BUT I BELIEVE THE APPLICANT HAS PLANS FOR WHAT TIME OF DAY THOSE SIGNS WILL BE ON, AND THEY COULD SPEAK TO THAT IN TERMS OF THE IMPACT OF THE RESIDENTS.

>> OTHER TECHNICAL QUESTIONS FOR STAFF, ANYBODY? COMMISSIONER LINGENFELTER.

>> I THINK MOST OF MY CONCERN, COMMISSIONER OLLEY, ADDRESSED WITH HIS, BUT COULD YOU MAYBE CLEARLY DEFINE QUASI FOR US?

>> SURE. QUASI-PUBLIC STREET IS A STREET THAT IS PRIVATELY OWNED AND MAINTAINED, BUT IT'S OPEN TO THE PUBLIC TO ACCESS, AND IT MEETS THE STANDARDS OF A PUBLIC STREET, BUT THE CITY DOES NOT MAINTAIN IT.

>> IT'S NOT CITY RIGHT AWAY.

>> THAT'S CORRECT.

>> AS HE ALLUDED TO, IT'S OWNED BY BY THE PROPERTY OWNER.

>> THAT'S RIGHT. HOWEVER, IT CAN FUNCTION AS AN ACCESS EASEMENT, AS I MENTIONED, OR A FIRE LANE.

>> THERE'S A PUBLIC ACCESS EASEMENT RUNNING DOWN THE TRAVEL LANES.

THE PUBLIC HAS RIGHTS TO USE THE STREET.

THEY CAN'T BLOCK IT OFF TO THE PUBLIC, BUT IT'S PRIVATELY OWNED AND MAINTAINED.

>> ARE THEY ABANDONING THAT EASEMENT?

>> THEY WILL ABANDON THE FIRE LANE PORTION, I BELIEVE THE ACCESS.

>> THEY'RE NOT ABANDONING THE ACCESS EASEMENT, BUT THEY ARE ABANDONING THE FIRE LANE.

[00:20:02]

>> THAT'S WHERE YOU DEFINE HALF OF IT STILL REMAINS.

>> RIGHT.

>> I DID WANT TO NOTE THAT COMMISSIONER TONG HAS JOINED US.

I'M SORRY, I JUST NOTICED YOU WERE HERE.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? NONE. LET ME OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING.

DO WE HAVE SPEAKERS ON THIS ITEM?

>> THERE ARE FIVE SPEAKERS. ALL FIVE ARE REGISTERED AS APPLICANTS.

>> THEN IS THERE ONE PARTICULAR ONE OF YOU THAT WANTS TO LEAD OFF OR HANDLE THIS PRESENTATION, OR HOW DO YOU-ALL WANT TO ADDRESS IT IF YOU'RE ALL LISTED AS APPLICANTS? I THINK WE HAVE MIGHT HAVE SOME QUESTIONS FOR YOU.

>> I'M NOT THAT GOOD AT BASEBALL, BUT I WILL LEAD OFF.

GOOD EVENING, COMMISSION. MY NAME IS RUPESH BHAKTA.

I'M THE CHIEF OPERATING OFFICER FOR PRISON PLACES, AND WE ARE THE OPERATING PARTNER FOR LEGACY WEST INVESTORS.

HERE WITH ME THIS EVENING IS OUR ENTIRE PROJECT TEAM.

FIRST AND FOREMOST, I'D LIKE TO THANK THE COMMISSION FOR THEIR TIME AND THOUGHTFUL CONSIDERATION THIS EVENING, AS WELL AS CITY STAFF FOR ALL THEIR TIME OVER THE PAST FEW YEARS BECAUSE IT'S BEEN A LONG TIME SINCE WE'VE BEEN PROCESSING THIS APPLICATION.

LEGACY WEST HAS EVOLVED OVER THE PAST DECADE INTO A TOP TIER MIXED USE ASSET NATIONWIDE, BOASTING OVER FIVE MILLION VISITS PER YEAR AND HOME TO SOME OF THE BEST BRANDS IN THE COUNTRY.

THE REASON WHY WE'RE HERE TODAY IS WE WANT TO MAINTAIN THAT STATUS AND TO PUSH LEGACY WEST TO THE NEXT LEVEL.

AS COMPETITION INCREASES AROUND US, WE FEEL THAT IT'S VERY IMPERATIVE TO REALLY IMPROVE WHAT WE HAVE TODAY AND TO MAINTAIN THOSE STANDARDS.

IN OUR PRESENTATION THIS EVENING, YOU WILL HEAR KEY WORDS SUCH AS WARMTH, RECREATION, ACTIVATION, ART, TECHNOLOGY, AND OPEN SPACE.

ALL THESE KEY WORDS HAVE BEEN THE FOUNDATION OF OUR DESIGN INTENT.

WITH THAT BEING SAID, I'D LIKE TO PASS THE MIKE TO JESSICA CLEMENTS.

MY NAME IS JESSICA CLEMENTS, AND I AM WITH STUDIO OUTSIDE LANDSCAPE ARCHITECTURE FIRM.

THANK YOU, DESTINY.

I DON'T KNOW WHERE SHE WENT, BUT THANK YOU FOR THE GREAT OPENING.

I'M GOING TO TRY TO PUT A LITTLE COLOR BEHIND SOME OF THE FACTUAL INFORMATION THAT WAS ALREADY EXPLAINED HERE THIS EVENING.

AS RUPESH MENTIONED, THE LEGACY WEST IS A BEAUTIFUL, VIBRANT SHOPPING CENTER WITHIN THE DFW REGION.

WE WANT TO TO JUST IMPROVE IT FROM A PUBLIC SPACES PERSPECTIVE.

OUR PROJECT IS REALLY FOCUSING ON OTHER THAN THE SIGNAGE REGIMEN, WHICH IS A LITTLE FURTHER WITHIN THE PROJECT, THE LANDSCAPE ARCHITECTURE AND THE ARCHITECTURE REALLY FOCUSES IN THE ENTRY PARK AND THE WATER STREET DEVELOPMENT THAT HAVE BEEN PREVIOUSLY TALKED ABOUT.

JUST ZEROING IN A LITTLE BIT MORE ON WATER STREET.

THIS ILLUSTRATIVE SITE PLAN REALLY SHOWS OUR INTENT.

WE ARE CLOSING DOWN WATER STREET, AND THE OBJECTIVE THERE IS REALLY TO TAKE A SPACE THAT WAS DESIGNED FOR THE VEHICLE AND THE PEDESTRIAN, BUT MAKE IT A LITTLE BIT MORE PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY.

SOME OF THE CRITIQUE THAT THE SHOPPING CENTER GETS NOW IS THAT IT'S HARD-EDGED, AND IT'S A LITTLE DENSE AND URBAN, AND THERE'S A LOT OF GREAT QUALITIES ABOUT THAT, BUT OUR GOAL HAS BEEN TO SOFTEN THAT SPACE AND JUST MAKE IT A LITTLE BIT MORE FRIENDLY FOR PEOPLE TO STAY AND LINGER AND REALLY ENJOY THE DEVELOPMENT AS A PUBLIC SPACE OR AS A PARK.

CLOSING DOWN WATER STREET TO VEHICULAR TRAFFIC ALLOWS US TO FOCUS IT IN AS A PEDESTRIAN SPACE, AND YOU CAN SEE RIGHT IN THE HEART OF WHAT WE'RE DESIGNING IS AN OPEN, FLEXIBLE LAWN SPACE.

ON ONE EDGE OF THE STREET, WE'RE ANCHORING IT WITH SOME REALLY BEAUTIFUL ART THAT A LATER SPEAKER WILL TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT.

THEN ON THE OTHER SIDE BOOK ENDING, THAT LAWN AREA IS A NEW PROPOSED PAVILION KIOSK THAT WILL PROBABLY HAVE SOME LIGHT FOOD AND BEVERAGE OFFERINGS IN IT.

REALLY, IS ACTING AS A WAY OF PROGRAMMING AND ACTIVATING THAT SPACE.

WE'VE BEEN VERY CONSCIOUS ABOUT MAKING SURE THAT PEOPLE ARE USING THAT SPACE IN ALL SORTS OF WAYS.

ALONG WINDROSE AVENUE, WE'RE ALSO PROPOSING SOME ENHANCEMENTS.

YOU CAN SEE THE PLAN HAS GOT A LOT OF NICE GREENS AND PINKS AND YELLOWS TO IT.

ALL OF THAT IS REPRESENTED BY ENHANCED PLANTING.

THERE IS AN ADDITION OF PLANTING THAT'S BEING ADDED TO THE STREET, WHICH DOES OFFER THAT SOFTENING THAT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT EARLIER.

IT ALSO IS HOLDING IN A COUPLE OF KEY ZONES THAT

[00:25:02]

WE'RE CALLING THESE OUTDOOR LIVING ROOMS. THOSE ARE DEFINED BY SOME UPGRADED PAVING, A LOT OF SEATING, AND SOME ENHANCED LIGHTING.

AGAIN, JUST PROVIDING MORE SPACES FOR THE VISITOR TO STAY AND ENJOY THE SPACE.

THESE ARE SOME CHARACTER IMAGES THAT LOOK AT SOME OF THE DESIGN IMPROVEMENTS THAT WE'RE MAKING TO THOSE SPACES, INCLUDING THE TREE TYPES, THE OPEN LAWN AREA.

YOU CAN SEE SOME IMAGES THAT REFLECT THE IDEA OF THE LIGHTING THAT'S A LITTLE BIT MORE PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY.

THEN THIS IMAGE HERE IS REALLY LOOKING AT THAT KIOSK SIDE, PAVILION SIDE, LOOKING RIGHT DOWN THE NEW LAWN AREA.

THE ENTRY PARK IS RIGHT OFF OF LEGACY DRIVE AS YOU ENTER INTO THE DEVELOPMENT.

THIS AREA REALLY OFFERED A WONDERFUL PLACE TO PROVIDE SOME INCREASED PEDESTRIAN ENHANCEMENTS.

THERE ARE SOME BEAUTIFUL LEGACY TREES HERE THAT WERE REMOVED FROM THE JCPENNEY CAMPUS BACK WHEN THE DEVELOPMENT WAS FIRST PUT IN PLACE.

THOSE TREES ARE A VISUAL ANCHOR TO THE PROPERTY, AND WE WANT TO MAKE THEM A LITTLE BIT MORE USABLE AND FRIENDLY FOR THE PEOPLE WHO ARE VISITING IT.

WHAT WE'RE DOING IS WE'RE PROVIDING ANOTHER OUTDOOR LIVING ROOM, IF YOU WILL, UNDERNEATH THIS BEAUTIFUL CANOPY OF TREES.

THEN FURTHER ACTIVATING THAT SPACE WITH ANOTHER PAVILION THAT COULD OFFER SOME LIGHT FOOD AND BEVERAGE, REALLY JUST PULLING THE PEDESTRIAN ACTIVITY DOWN TO THE SIDE OF THE DEVELOPMENT.

ALL OF THESE IMPROVEMENTS ARE BEING MADE WITH SOME REDUCTION OF PARKING.

ALTHOUGH WE HAVE CHECKED THAT IT'S ALL WITHIN THE CODE PARAMETERS OF THE PROJECT.

HERE YOU CAN SEE SOME IMAGES THAT HIGHLIGHT HOW SOME OF THESE SPACES WILL LOOK AND FEEL.

THEN THIS PERSPECTIVE, I THINK, REALLY ILLUSTRATING THE IDEA OF THE PLANTING, YOU CAN SEE HOW THAT'S HOLDING THE SPACES IN.

THAT PLANTING IS NOT JUST MEANT TO SOFTEN, BUT ALSO, TO HOLD THE PEDESTRIAN AND GIVE THEM A FEELING OF PROTECTIVE QUALITIES FROM THE VEHICULAR TRAFFIC THAT'S COMING BY.

I'M GOING TO TURN THIS OVER TO BARRY HAND, WHO'S GOING TO TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THE SIGNAGE AND GRAPHICS PROGRAM. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> GOOD EVENING. IT'S GOOD TO BE BACK.

THANK YOU FOR HAVING US.

I'M GOING TO TALK QUICKLY BECAUSE DESTINY DID A GREAT JOB RUNNING THROUGH THE SIGNS THAT YOU'RE CONSIDERING, BUT I WANT TO GIVE YOU A SLIGHTLY LARGER VIEW.

THEN I WANT TO INVITE OUR ARTIST TEAM UP TO JUST SHOW YOU THE FINAL COMPONENT OF REALLY BRINGING THE PROJECT UP TO THE NEXT LEVEL.

YOU CAN SEE THE DIFFERENT SIGN TYPES.

THEY ARE GOING TO BE DEPLOYED IN THE NEXT PROJECT, STARTING WITH DIRECTIONALS AT THE ENTRY.

YOU'RE NOT CONSIDERING THOSE NECESSARILY, BUT JUST IN THE NAME OF SHOWING YOU THE ENTIRE PACKAGE, THIS IS COMING OFF OF LEGACY.

THEN UP AT HEADQUARTERS, YOU'LL SEE THESE TYPE OF DIRECTIONALS AND IDENTITY GATEWAYS ON THE NORTH AND SOUTH SIDES.

VEHICULAR DIRECTIONALS, AS I MENTIONED, TRAFFIC AND INTUITIVE CIRCULATION IS THE LIFEBLOOD OF THESE PROJECTS.

IF PEOPLE CAN'T FIGURE OUT WHERE THEY'RE GOING AND HAVE A DIFFICULT TIME PARKING, THEY WON'T COME BACK.

OBVIOUSLY, LEGACY WEST HAS BEEN EXQUISITELY SUCCESSFUL, BUT ALL THESE PROJECTS HAVE TO STAY RELEVANT.

THAT'S AS RUPESH MENTIONED, WE'RE ALWAYS IMPROVING THEM AND FEEDBACK FROM THE CITY, FEEDBACK FROM CUSTOMERS, AND ALWAYS TWEAKING THE MECHANISM.

PARKING DIRECTIONALS. AGAIN, AS I MENTIONED, PARKING IS THE LIFEBLOOD OF THESE PROJECTS.

ONCE YOU GET INTO THE PARKING DECK, HOW DO YOU KNOW TO GET BACK TO YOUR CAR? THERE WILL BE SOME IMPROVEMENTS INSIDE THE PARKING DECK.

THEN ONCE YOU'RE OUT INTO THE LIFESTYLE STREET, THESE PASEOS BACK INTO THE PARKING GARAGE, JUST UPGRADING THESE A LITTLE BIT, UPDATING THEM.

THIS IS THE MAP THAT DESTINY SHOWED YOU.

DESTINY DID A GREAT JOB OF SHOWING YOU THE THREE SIGNS THAT WILL BE CONSIDERED.

THESE DIGITAL KIOSKS, THERE'S ACTUALLY SEVEN OF THESE ON THE GROUND.

ONE IS IN THE FOOD HALL.

THESE ARE VIDEO BOARDS OR DIGITAL BOARDS THAT ALLOW FOR CHANGING STATIC IMAGES.

THIS IS THE ONE THAT WAS REFERENCED EARLIER, ENTERING THE PROJECT ABOVE EARLS.

THIS WOULD ALSO BE A DIGITAL SIGN OF 45 BY 20.

YOU SAW THE AREA MAXIMUMS ON DESTINY'S PRESENTATION.

THEN THIS IS THE ONE ANGLED IN THE PLAN AT J CREW.

I WANT TO CHECK MY TIME HERE.

[00:30:01]

THIS IS THE ONE AT J CREW THAT'S FACING IN AN ANGLED WAY ON THE STREET.

THIS IS ACROSS FROM THE FOUNTAIN, AND ULTIMATELY, WHERE THE PROPOSED LAWN IS.

LAST BUT NOT LEAST, WE'VE GOT THESE TWO STATIC SIGNS GOING INTO THE PARKING GARAGES.

LET ME JUST SAY, IN CASE YOU'RE WONDERING, THE PURPOSE OF THESE IS ALSO ABOUT BRAND EXPERIENCE.

AS RETAIL CONTINUES TO MORPH AND AS OMNI CHANNEL RETAILERS WANT THAT BRAND EXPRESSION AND COMMUNICATION BACK TO CUSTOMERS AND USERS.

THIS IS REALLY PART OF THE FINAL PIECE OF THE PACKAGE FOR RETAILERS.

KEEPING THEM SUCCESSFUL IS TO EVERYONE'S ADVANTAGE.

THEN LAST BUT NOT LEAST, THE USERS LIKE YOU AND ME, WHO GO THERE FROM TIME TO TIME, HAVING THAT COMMUNICATION ON THE GROUND CAN BE VERY GOOD, WHETHER IT'S THE DIGITAL KIOSK OR ULTIMATELY, THESE LARGER STATIC BOARDS.

WE'RE HERE FOR QUESTIONS.

OF COURSE, WE'LL STAY AS LONG AS YOU GUYS WANT TO STAY.

WE KNOW YOU HAVE AN AGENDA.

REALLY OUR APPRECIATION TO STAFF.

I WANT TO INVITE THE OLDHAMS UP TO TALK.

YOU'RE NOT CONSIDERING THIS, BUT AGAIN, I WANT YOU TO SEE THE FINAL PIECE OF ARTWORK THAT'S BEING SCHEDULED FOR THE PROJECT.

WE THINK THIS IS SOMETHING PEOPLE WILL DRIVE 25 MILES TO SEE.

AS YOU DRIVE AROUND THE METROPLEX, YOU'RE STARTING TO SEE THIS LARGE FORMAT SCULPTURE COME INTO PROJECTS.

THEY'LL SHOW YOU SOME REFERENCES DOWN IN DEEP ELLUM.

THIS IS ALL ABOUT KEEPING THE PROJECT CURRENT AND RELEVANT INTO THE NEXT DECADE. TAKE IT AWAY.

>> HI, EVERYBODY. I'M BRAD OLDHAM.

THIS IS MY PARTNER, CHRISTY COLTRIN.

CHRISTY IS GOING TO TAKE IT OVER AND GO THROUGH IT, AND THEN I'LL FINISH UP.

>> LIKE BRAD SAID, CHRISTY COLTRIN AND BRAD OLDHAM, AND WE CREATE SITE SPECIFIC PLACEMAKING SCULPTURES FOR COMMUNITIES, COMPANIES, AND COLLECTORS ACROSS THE COUNTRY. WE'RE ALWAYS HONORED.

WE'RE BASED IN DOWNTOWN DALLAS.

WE'VE BEEN DOING THIS 26 YEARS NOW, BUT WE'RE ALWAYS HONORED WHEN WE GET TO WORK NEAR HOME.

THIS IS A PICTURE OF US WITH OUR STAFF DOWNTOWN.

HERE'S AN EXAMPLE OF RECENT INSTALLATIONS USING OUR MIRROR POLISHED STAINLESS STEEL.

YOU'LL SEE IN THE LOWER RIGHT CORNER IS THE TRAVELING MAN.

THAT'S WHAT BARRY REFERENCED IN DEEP ELLUM.

IT'S A 40 FOOT TALL SCULPTURE.

IN THE LOWER LEFT CORNER IS A SCULPTURE IN OKLAHOMA CITY CALLED CLOUD TREES, AND THAT ONE IS 61,000 POUNDS.

IT'S HUGE. IT'S AWESOME, AND IT'S OVER A PROGRAMMED STAGE AREA.

IT'S A SITE SPECIFIC DESTINATION WORTHY SCULPTURE THAT ALSO PROVIDES FUNCTION FOR EVENTS AND COMMUNITY EVENTS.

THE INSPIRATION FOR THIS SCULPTURE FIRST CAME FROM THE TRUMPET VINE AND THE VIBRANT COLORS, THE NEAT SHAPE, THE ATHLETICNESS OF THE VINE.

I WANT YOU TO HOLD ON TO THESE COLORS AS WE LOOK THROUGH THE REST OF THE SLIDES, AND WE'LL GO VERY QUICKLY.

WE CAN ANSWER QUESTIONS AT THE END IF YOU HAVE THOSE.

THE FIRST INSTALLATION IS IN THE PARK ON WATER STREET.

THERE'LL BE A COMMUNITY STAGE THERE.

THIS IS THE TRUMPET VINE BALLET, THE PERFORMANCE.

THIS IS A SCULPTURE MADE OF MIRROR-POLISHED STAINLESS STEEL, CANTILEVERED OVER THE STAGE, AND IN THE BLOOMS, YOU'LL SEE, THERE ARE BALLET DANCERS COMING OUT OF THE BLOOMS. THIS IS A FRAMEWORK FOR EVENTS THAT WILL HAPPEN ON THAT STAGE.

IT'S ALSO A DESTINATION OF A FREE STANDING SITE-SPECIFIC SCULPTURE.

WE FEEL LIKE THIS BOTANICAL, THIS COLOR, WILL PULL YOU INTO THE PARK.

WE REALLY WANTED TO HAVE SOME VIBRANCY HAPPENING HERE.

THIS IS JUST A DETAIL.

FOR US, CLAY COMES FIRST, AND THIS IS A DETAIL OF THE CHARMING DANCER HOLDING ONTO THE VINE.

ANOTHER ONE, ANOTHER ONE.

THIS IS TRUMPET VINE BALLERINA MISTY.

SHE IS EIGHT FEET TALL.

THIS IS A COLLECTION OF SCULPTURE THROUGHOUT THE CAMPUS, STARTING AT THE STAGE, AND THEN YOU'LL FIND THE DANCERS INDIVIDUALLY IN DIFFERENT SPOTS THROUGHOUT THE CAMPUS.

EIGHT FEET TALL TO THE TOP OF HER OUTSTRETCHED HAND.

THERE'S A CLAY MODEL. THERE'S MARTHA.

MARTHA AND MISTY WILL BE NEAR THE NIKE STORE. THEY'LL BE TOGETHER.

WE HAVE A TRUMPET VINE BALLET CLASS.

THIS WILL BE BETWEEN MENDOCINO FARMS AND STARBUCKS.

AS YOU WALK IN, IT'S A NICE GREETING.

THEN THE LAST INSTALLATION WILL BE SOFIA, AND SHE'S IN FRONT OF THE FOOD HALL.

>> AS CHRISTY MENTIONED, WE'VE BEEN DOING THIS FOR A VERY LONG TIME.

WE USE VERY STRONG MATERIALS,

[00:35:01]

MARINE GRADE, STAINLESS STEEL. IT DOESN'T RUST.

MOST OF THE SKETCHES AND CLAYS YOU SEE, THOSE ARE NOT THE ENGINEERED PIECES.

THESE WILL BE ENGINEERED TO WITHSTAND OVER 100 MILE IN HOUR WINDS AND MULTIPLE PEOPLE CLIMBING ON THEM, THINGS LIKE THAT.

THE COLORS ARE POLYURETHANE AUTOMOTIVE PAINTS.

THEY HOLD UP THE SAME AS A CAR WOULD.

VERY DURABLE AND MAINTENANCE IS PRETTY MINIMAL ON ALL THESE ITEMS. BUT WE'D BE HONORED TO BE A PART OF THIS, AND WE'RE EXCITED ABOUT BEING A PART OF PLANO AS WELL. THANK YOU.

>> THAT CONCLUDES OUR PRESENTATION.

I THINK WE GET BONUS POINTS FOR DOING IT FASTER THAN 15 MINUTES, MR. CHAIRMAN, IS THAT TRUE?

>> I CAN'T SPEAK FOR THE REST OF THE COMMISSION, BUT I DO APPRECIATE YOU KEEPING IT TIMELY.

>> THERE YOU GO. WE'RE HERE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE.

WE KNOW YOU HAVE SOME SPEAKERS SIGNED UP, POSSIBLY, BUT WE RESPECTFULLY REQUEST YOUR RECOMMENDATION AND WE LOOK FORWARD TO GOING TO COUNCIL.

>> GREAT. STAY RIGHT THERE JUST A SECOND.

DO WE HAVE OTHER SPEAKERS REGISTERED ON THIS SIDE?

>> THERE ARE NO OTHER SPEAKERS.

>> I'LL LEAD OFF WITH ONE QUESTION AS YOU SAID SOMETHING THAT I DIDN'T SEE IN THE STAFF REPORT.

YOU SAID THAT THE DIGITAL SIGNS WOULD HAVE CHANGING STATIC IMAGES.

>> WELL, THE PURPOSE OF VIDEO IS THAT THEY CAN CHANGE OVER A PERIOD OF TIME.

IT'S NOT ANIMATION OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.

THE CITY'S SIGN CRITERIA WILL NOT ALLOW MOVING IMAGES.

BUT AS YOU SEE IN YOUR CITY, THERE ARE PERIODIC CHANGES TO THOSE IMAGES.

>> THIS IS NOT GOING TO BE VIDEO.

>> NO.

>> THEY'RE GOING TO BE CHANGING STATIC LIKE ANY OTHER SIGN IN TOWN.

>> SOMEONE SAID EARLIER TODAY, A CAROUSEL OF CHANGING SLIDES.

THINK OF IT THAT WAY.

>> GREAT. THANK YOU FOR THE CLARIFICATION.

>> SURE.

>> COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF.

>> THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. THIS THING WILL BLAST YOUR EARS OUT IF I GET TOO CLOSE, SORRY.

>> ACTUALLY, I CAN BARELY HEAR YOU.

>> WELL, IN THAT CASE.

>> SPEAK UP. BRING IT ON.

>> A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS.

WITH REGARD TO RESIDENTIAL UNITS OVERLOOKING WATER STREET AND WINDROSE AVENUE, DO THOSE APARTMENT UNITS COME WITH EITHER BLINDS OR CURTAINS OR IF THEY DON'T, ARE THE RESIDENTS ENTITLED TO INSTALL THEIR OWN?

>> WE'RE NOT HERE REPRESENTING THE OPERATOR OF THE APARTMENTS, BUT LET ME ANSWER YOUR FIRST QUESTION. WHERE ARE WE HERE? IF YOU LOOK TO YOUR LEFT IN THIS IMAGE, THESE ARE THE APARTMENT UNITS, AS YOU GO DOWN WATER STREET, THE ONE RIGHT THERE OVER THE RESTAURANT, THAT WOULD BE LOOKING OVER THE LAWN AT WATER STREET.

WE ACTUALLY THINK THOSE BECOME PREMIUM UNITS ONCE THIS PROJECT IS FINISHED.

AS FAR AS THE SIGNAGE THAT YOU SEE AT J.

CREW, THE LITTLE ROUND TURRET, THAT WOULD BE FACING IN AN OBLIQUE WAY, IN AN ANGULAR WAY, THE APARTMENTS THAT FACE THE MULTIFAMILY UNITS THAT DO FACE WINDROSE, RIGHT THERE.

BUT LET ME STRESS, THESE SIGNS WOULD BE UNDER THE SAME CRITERIA THAT ALL DIGITAL OR ELECTRONIC SIGNS IN YOUR CITY HAVE.

WE WOULD WORK WITH THE OPERATOR AND MAKE SURE THAT THOSE ARE NOT A DISTRACTION AT NIGHT.

I CAN'T ANSWER YOUR QUESTION ABOUT LEASE AGREEMENTS AND INSTALLING BLINDS IN AN APARTMENT, BUT I'M SURE THAT ALL THESE APARTMENTS, YOU CAN SEE HAVE SOME FORM OF BLINDING ON THE BLIND TREATMENT ON THE WINDOWS.

>> HAVE YOU CONSIDERED THE IMPACT OF NOISE FROM THE OUTDOOR STAGE ON THE OVERLOOKING RESIDENTIAL UNITS?

>> YEAH. OBVIOUSLY, WHEN YOU DO A PROJECT LIKE THIS WITH A STAGE, THERE HAS TO BE OPERATIONAL HOURS.

BUT HONESTLY, WE DON'T ANTICIPATE AND I'LL LET RUPE SPEAK AS THE OPERATOR.

WE ANTICIPATE SMALL ACOUSTIC TYPE ACTS AT THIS.

IF THERE'S A FESTIVAL ONCE OR TWICE A YEAR WHERE THEY ROTATE BANDS THROUGH THIS LITTLE STAGE, IT'S NOT A BIG STAGE.

IT'S VERY SMALL.

WE ANTICIPATE THIS IS GOING TO BE MORE LIKE ACOUSTIC ACTS, MAYBE KIDS DANCING TROOPS.

IF THERE'S A FESTIVAL AGAIN AND THEY CLOSE OFF THIS LITTLE BLOCK OF WINDROSE FOR A WEEKEND, THERE MIGHT BE SOMETHING.

AGAIN, THOSE TYPICALLY ARE SHUT DOWN BY A CERTAIN TIME AT NIGHT.

>> NO, I'M THINKING THAT A BAND OF JUST FOUR GUYS WITH THEIR ELECTRIC INSTRUMENTS CAN MAKE A WHOLE LOT OF NOISE IF THEY WANT TO.

>> FOR SURE.

>> HAVE YOU CONSIDERED OTHER FORMS OF USABLE OPEN SPACE RATHER THAN AN OUTDOOR STAGE?

>> WELL, AGAIN, THE STAGE IS FOR A LOT OF PURPOSES.

THE OPERATOR HAS TALKED ABOUT HAVING FASHION SHOWS HERE.

THEY'LL BRING IN RISERS AND DO OTHER THINGS.

THERE'S A RANGE OF ACTIVITIES THAT WILL HAPPEN ON THIS STAGE.

>> NO, I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT JUST BEING REALISTIC, I FORESEE THAT THERE'S GOING TO BE SOME LIVE MUSIC ON THAT STAGE, AND I'M WONDERING ABOUT THE NOISE IMPACT.

>> THOSE WOULD HAVE THE SAME OPERATIONAL CRITERIA THAT ANYTHING IN A DEVELOPMENT LIKE THIS WITH RESIDENTIAL HAS.

IT'LL NEED TO BE SHUT DOWN BY A CERTAIN TIME OF NIGHT.

>> HOW WOULD YOU ENFORCE THAT?

>> IT'S ENFORCED IN ALL THE OPERATIONAL CONTRACTS.

[00:40:05]

>> I THINK THE OPERATOR HAS AN INCENTIVE TO ENFORCE, AND THE CITY ORDINANCES, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN, WE WILL ENFORCE SOME OF IT IF YOU GO ABOVE YOUR SKILLS.

>> MR. OLLEY.

I DO STILL HAVE A QUESTION ON THAT PARTICULAR SIGN FACING THE APARTMENTS.

FROM A OPERATIONAL PERSPECTIVE SUNSET, IS IT A TOTAL SHUTDOWN, OR IS IT JUST MORE OF A DIMING? WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE?

>> I'M GOING TO GET INTO SOME REAL WEEDS HERE QUICKLY ON ELECTRONIC LED SIGNAGE.

THIS DIRECT VIEW SIGNAGE, JUST FROM PAST PROJECTS WE'VE DONE, THEY TYPICALLY LOWER IT TO ABOUT A 5% POWER, AND IT'LL BE LIKE YOU SEE ON SCREEN SAVERS, WHETHER IT'S STARS OR WHAT.

THEY DON'T TURN THEM OFF, TYPICALLY.

BUT THEY'LL POWER IT DOWN TO ABOUT 2-5% POWER.

YOU REALLY WON'T SEE MUCH.

IF YOU GO TO THE DISCOVERY DISTRICT IN DOWNTOWN, THEY PUT IT TO BED.

THEY PUT THAT VIDEO SCREEN TO BED, AND IT'S JUST A VERY LOW POWER, ALMOST AMBIENT TYPE DARKNESS THAT COMES OUT OF IT.

>> FROM THERE HAVE YOU CONSIDERED THE ADDITIONAL FOOT TRAFFIC TURNING WATER STREET INTO ESSENTIALLY A UTILITY STAGE AND WHAT HAVE YOU? MAYBE THIS IS MORE FOR THE TRAFFIC ENGINEER, DO WE HAVE A GOOD SENSE OF HOW WE CAN REGULATE THE FLOW OF THAT FOOT TRAFFIC IN AND OUT IN SUCH A WAY THAT WE'RE NOT CAUSING CHOKE POINTS ON INTENDED CONSEQUENCES.

>> WELL, WE ALWAYS LOVE IT WHEN PEOPLE TALK ABOUT FOOT TRAFFIC AND A MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT, BECAUSE THAT IS THE INTENT, TO NOT ONLY INCREASE FOOT TRAFFIC, BUT FOR THE FOOT TRAFFIC THAT'S HERE, KEEP THEM HERE.

JESSICA TALKED ABOUT THESE OUTDOOR LIVING ROOMS. SOME OF THE CRITICISM THAT WE'VE GOTTEN EVEN FROM THE CITY, BESIDES THE FACT THAT THERE'S NOT ENOUGH GREEN SPACE IS THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE FURNITURE.

THERE NEEDS TO BE PLACES FOR PEOPLE TO LINGER AND STAY.

THAT'S WHY YOU SEE THE OUTDOOR FURNITURE AND THE LIVING ROOMS AND THE FIRE PITS AND THINGS LIKE THAT AT DIFFERENT PLACES.

AS FAR AS MANAGING THE FOOTFALL, IF YOU DRIVE DOWN WINDROSE ON PRETTY MUCH ANY GIVEN NIGHT, YOU'LL NOTICE THAT THE TRAFFIC MOVES REALLY SLOW.

THE PRESENCE OF PEDESTRIANS TENDS TO BE A TRAFFIC CALMING DEVICE.

WE THINK ACTUALLY CLOSING WATER STREET MAKES IT A SAFER PLACE.

A LOT OF TIMES WHEN THERE'S SLOW TRAFFIC, THAT'S OBVIOUSLY QUITE NATURALLY A SAFER PLACE FOR PEDESTRIANS.

WHAT WE DON'T WANT IS PEOPLE RACING DOWN WINDROSE.

CLOSING WATER STREET, WE THINK HELPS THAT TRAFFIC CONGESTION WITH CARS.

WE DO HAVE A REP FROM KIMLEY-HORN HERE THAT CAN TALK ABOUT TRAFFIC IF THERE ARE DETAILED QUESTIONS ABOUT TRAFFIC AND PARKING.

>> THANK YOU, CHAIRMAN. WHAT'S THE APPROXIMATE SIZE? JUST FULL DISCLOSURE.

>> MR. BENDER.

I LIVED AT THE VILLAS ACROSS THE STREET ACROSS COMMUNICATIONS FOR SIX PLUS YEARS.

I'M VERY FAMILIAR. I WALKED THIS DEVELOPMENT EVERY EVENING.

>> YOU WERE IN THE TOWN HOUSES?

>> I WAS IN THE SINGLE FAMILY HOMES ACTUALLY.

SIX FEET APART, THREE STORIES TALL.

>> THEY'RE NOT THE TOWN HOUSES.

>> YEAH. THEY ARE TOWNS HOUSES.

>> VERY GOOD.

>> BUT THESE ARE GREAT ENHANCEMENTS.

SOME OTHER COMMENTS, I'LL SAVE FOR LATER.

BUT HAVING LIVED THERE, WALKED IT, WHAT'S THE APPROXIMATE SIZE OF THE GREEN SPACE THAT'S GOING TO BE ADDED?

>> I THINK WE SAW IN THE PREVIOUS REPORT, IT'S ABOUT 0.18 ACRES.

THE AREA THAT WE'RE CLOSING FOR PUBLIC ON WATER STREET IS ABOUT 0.18 ACRES.

WE'RE ACTUALLY AT NET GAIN OF OPEN SPACE IN THE PROJECT.

>> OTHER DEVELOPMENTS LIKE THIS THAT HAVE THAT SPACE, IT WORKS GREAT. I WOULD SAY THAT.

JUST A COUPLE OF OTHER COMMENTS, HAVING BEEN THERE DURING COVID, AND THERE WAS A LOT OF FURNITURE AND OUTDOOR SEATING AREAS THAT WAS DONE ON PURPOSE DURING COVID.

IT WAS REALLY INCREDIBLE TO SEE THE GATHERING AND THE ATMOSPHERE THAT YOU'RE TRYING TO CREATE REALLY OCCURRED DURING COVID, EVEN THOUGH IT WAS COVID.

BUT THAT GREEN SPACE IS REALLY NEEDED, AND I THINK TO YOUR POINT, HAVING LIVED THERE AND SEEN THE TRAFFIC, AND ALL THE THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN DONE OVER THE COURSE OF TIME TO CONTROL THAT TRAFFIC, THE SIGNAGE IS REALLY NEEDED, AND I THINK THE CLOSURE OF WATER STREET WILL BE A PLUS.

>> GREAT.

>> THAT'S ALL THE COMMENTS I HAD.

>> VERY GOOD, SIR. THANK YOU.

>> COMMISSIONERS, OTHER QUESTIONS?

[00:45:03]

I HAD ONE FOLLOW UP, AND I'M NOT SURE WHO'D ASK THIS QUESTION OF, I PRESUME, BUT I FEEL COMPELLED TO ASK THE QUESTION THAT THE TWO MULTI FAMILY COMPLEXES ON EITHER SIDE OF THE STREET BEING CLOSED ARE SUPPORTIVE OF THIS REQUEST? COME ON UP SO WE CAN GET YOU ON THE RECORD.

>> WHAT I WAS GOING TO SAY IS THE OWNER OF ALL OF THIS OWNS ALL PARCELS, THE MULTIFAMILY.

>> I DIDN'T KNOW IF IT WAS THE SAME OPERATOR REGARDLESS OF OWNERSHIP, IF THE OPERATORS ARE SUPPORTIVE.

>> SAME OWNER OPERATOR.

>> GREAT. JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY THAT FOR THE RECORD.

COMMISSIONERS, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? NOBODY THE SPEAKERS REGISTERED? I'LL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF.

>> YES, MR. CHAIRMAN, LET ME CLARIFY WHERE I'M COMING FROM ON THIS.

I THINK IN GENERAL, THE CONCEPT IS GREAT.

WITH RESPECT TO THE SIGNAGE ON THE BUILDINGS AND THE PARKING GARAGES, I HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEM WITH IT.

I THINK THEY SERVE A USEFUL PURPOSE.

THEY'RE ATTRACTIVE.

WITHOUT KNOWING SPECIFICALLY, I'M WILLING TO MAKE A REALISTIC ASSUMPTION THAT APARTMENT UNITS ARE GOING TO HAVE BLINDS OR CURTAINS.

THAT'S JUST THE WAY THINGS ARE.

I DON'T SEE ANY INTERFERENCE FROM THE SIGNAGE.

THE KIOSKS PROVIDING ADVERTISING AND TRAFFIC DIRECTION ARE A GOOD IDEA.

OBVIOUSLY, THEY CREATE THE NEED TO REPLACE THE OPEN SPACE THAT NOW EXISTS THAT WOULD BE LOST TO THE KIOSKS.

THAT'S WHY THEY WANT TO CLOSE OFF WATER STREET AND MAKE HALF OF IT INTO AN OPEN SPACE.

I UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO DO.

THE CLOSING OFF OF WATER STREET BY ITSELF DOES NOT CONCERN ME.

IT'S A PRIVATE STREET.

IT DOES NOT CREATE A PUBLIC RIGHT TO USE IT AS A THOROUGHFARE, AND THE TRAFFIC DEPARTMENT HAS LOOKED AT IT AND FOUND THAT THE TRAFFIC IMPACT OF CLOSING OFF WATER STREET WOULD BE MINIMAL.

IF THEY WANT TO TURN IT INTO A PEDESTRIAN-FRIENDLY AREA, I THINK THAT'S A GOOD IDEA.

WITH RESPECT TO THE OPEN SPACE, JUST GOING BACK WHEN THIS DEVELOPMENT WAS INITIALLY APPROVED, THE CITY GRANTED THE APPLICANT AT THAT TIME CREDIT TOWARD THE OPEN SPACE REQUIREMENT FOR A PROPOSED PARK ON THE OTHER SIDE, THE WEST SIDE OF COMMUNICATIONS PARKWAY.

I AM DISAPPOINTED THAT THE CITY HAS NOT MOVED FORWARD WITH THAT PARK.

APPARENTLY, THEY OWN THE LAND, BUT THEY DON'T HAVE ANY IMMEDIATE PLANS TO DEVELOP IT, AS WE LEARNED DURING THE PRELIMINARY OPEN MEETING EARLIER THIS EVENING.

BUT I THINK THAT BALL IS IN THE CITY'S COURT, NOT THE APPLICANT'S COURT.

I WOULD JUST LIKE TO ADD A COMMENT THAT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE CITY MOVE FORWARD ON THAT PARK BECAUSE IT'S AN AMENITY WHICH WOULD ADD TO THE ATTRACTIVENESS OF THIS DEVELOPMENT AND THE RESIDENTS OF THIS DEVELOPMENT.

>> MR. BRAWNER?

>> I BELIEVE WE HAVE SOME INFORMATION ABOUT THAT, MR. BRAWNER.

>> YEAH.

>> IN TERMS OF THE FUNDING FOR THAT PARK, AS OF OUR CURRENT CIP, ONLY DESIGN FUNDS HAVE BEEN APPROVED, AND DESIGN IS UNDERWAY, BUT NO CONSTRUCTION FUNDS HAVE BEEN APPROVED, AND IT'S NOT IDENTIFIED AS A ITEM IN THE UPCOMING BOND.

>> WELL, I'D LIKE TO SEE IT IDENTIFIED PRETTY SOON.

OTHERWISE, AN ASSUMPTION THAT WAS MADE AS PART OF THE INITIAL APPROVAL, THIS DEVELOPMENT HAS NOT COME TO FRUITION, AND THAT'S NOT THE APPLICANT'S FAULT.

NOW, THE ONE AREA OF CONCERN I HAVE IS THAT STAGE.

IT IS UNAVOIDABLE THAT THAT STAGE WILL BE USED FOR LIVE MUSIC AT SOME POINT.

LIVE MUSIC WILL NECESSARILY BE LOUD, AND IT WILL BE LOUD RIGHT UNDERNEATH RESIDENTIAL UNITS, AND TO ME, THAT WOULD BE A MAJOR DISTURBANCE AND A NEGATIVE IMPACT AGAINST RESIDENTS.

>> IT COULD POTENTIALLY BE A DISTURBANCE AND AN INTERFERENCE WITH THE QUIET ENJOYMENT OF THEIR RESIDENTIAL UNITS TO THE RESIDENTS, WHETHER THAT MUSIC TAKES PLACE AT 7:00 P.M. 8:00 P.M. 9:00 P.M, NOT TO MENTION AFTER 10:00 P.M WHEN IT OUGHT TO BE SHUT DOWN ANYWAY.

I WANT TO ASK MR. BELL, DOES THE CITY HAVE ANY ORDINANCES THAT WOULD REGULATE THE GENERATION OF NOISE, AND HOW WOULD THEY APPLY TO THAT STAGE, POTENTIALLY?

>> YES, THE CITY DOES HAVE A NOISE ORDINANCE THAT IT ENFORCES.

I BELIEVE THERE WAS AN ISSUE WITH NOISE COMING FROM ONE OF THESE PROPERTIES ON THE NORTH SIDE, THE FOOD HALL, AND SO IT'S NOT REGULATED BY PLANNING, I BELIEVE IT'S ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH, WHO REGULATES THAT.

THEY'LL ACTUALLY GO OUT AND MEASURE THE NOISE AT THE TIME THAT THE NOISE IS HAPPENING AND TAKE MEASUREMENTS,

[00:50:02]

AND IF THERE'S AN ISSUE, THEY WILL TAKE ENFORCEMENT ACTIONS.

I DON'T KNOW THE SPECIFICS OF WHAT THOSE STANDARDS ARE, BUT I KNOW THAT THEY DO ENFORCE IT.

>> WELL BUT A MUSIC ACT JUST MIGHT BE BOOKED FOR ONE OR TWO EVENINGS, AND BY THE TIME ENVIRONMENTAL,

>> LET ME JUMP IN HERE BECAUSE I LIVE TWO BLOCKS FROM MCCALL PLAZA WHERE THERE ARE MUSIC ACTS ON A REGULAR BASIS, AND THE STAFF HAS BEEN VERY ATTENTIVE TO THE RESIDENTS.

I WILL ALSO TELL YOU THAT ON ANY NIGHT, THERE IS AN ACT ON MCCALL PLAZA, PROBABLY A THIRD OF THE BALCONIES OVERLOOKING MCCALL PLAZA, HAVE PEOPLE SITTING ON THEM IN LAWN CHAIRS.

>> WELL, BUT THERE COULD BE PEOPLE WHO SO ARE DISTURBED BY IT THAT'S ALL I'M SAYING.

>> BUT THE STAFF HAS BEEN VERY GOOD BECAUSE THE NEIGHBORS DID RAISE SOME CONCERNS ABOUT IT INITIALLY, AND THE STAFF HAS BEEN GREAT ABOUT ENFORCING THE NOISE ORDINANCE JUST SPEAKING FROM EXPERIENCE, THE MCCALL PLAZA IS A VERY SIMILAR.

>> I JUST WANT TO ADD, THERE'S NOTHING PREVENTING THEM FROM PUTTING THE STAGE ELSEWHERE ON THE SIDE, AS LONG AS IT'S NOT AN EASEMENT OR SIDEWALK OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

THEY COULD HAVE THE BANDS ANY OTHER LOCATION.

THAT'S JUST WHAT THEY'RE PLANNING FOR THE ACTIVITY OF THIS OPEN SPACE AREA.

>> I WAS JUST THINKING THERE ARE OTHER FORMS OF OPEN SPACE THEY COULD CONSIDER, LIKE A GREEN AREA, A PLAN WITH PLANTINGS, WALKWAYS, PICNIC TABLES, PARK BENCHES, GAZEBOS, LOTS OF SCULPTURE.

I LOVE THE SCULPTURE IDEA, BUT THERE ARE ALTERNATIVES.

BUT ONE THING I'M HESITATING ABOUT IS THE NOISE, AND THAT'S ALL.

>> THANK YOU, SIR. COMMISSIONER OLLEY.

>> I THINK WHAT WE ARE MEANT TO LOOK AT TODAY MORE THAN ANYTHING IS SIGNAGE.

GIVEN THAT WATER STREET IS ESSENTIALLY A PRIVATELY OWNED PARCEL OF LAND.

HAVING BEEN IN LEGACY WEST, I THINK THERE'S AN ASSUMPTION IF YOU LIVE THERE, THERE'S A CERTAIN LEVEL OF NOISE BECAUSE JUST FORGET THAT LIVE STAGE, THERE'S MUSIC USUALLY PLAYING AT NIGHT FROM SPEAKERS, AND THERE'S ALMOST AN ASSUMPTION.

THE TENANTS WILL VOTE WITH THEIR FEET IF THAT HAPPENS TO BE THE CASE.

I ALWAYS BIAS TOWARDS OPEN SPACE ANYONE WHO WHO KNOWS ME ON THIS, I BIAS TOWARDS OPEN SPACE AND ENVIRONMENTAL STANDARDS AGAIN, GIVEN ULTIMATELY THIS FEELS LIKE A REFRESH OF A MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT, I WILL MAKE A MOTION FOR CONSIDERATION.

>> HANG ON ONE SECOND.

I THINK WE HAVE SOME OTHER COMMENTS, SO HOLD THAT THOUGHT.

COMMISSIONER BENDER. I'LL COME BACK TO YOU, I PROMISE.

>> JUST A COUPLE COMMENTS.

AGAIN, MY PERSPECTIVE IS HAVING LIVED THERE FOR SIX PLUS YEARS.

PART OF THE REASON THAT WE MOVED TO THE VILLAS IS THE ENERGY THAT'S CREATED, WHICH I THINK YOU WERE REFERRING TO THAT PEOPLE THAT COME INTO THAT DEVELOPMENT ARE THERE FOR A REASON BECAUSE OF THE ENERGY, THE ENTERTAINMENT, THE THINGS THAT ARE HAPPENING THE VIBE THAT IS IN THAT DEVELOPMENT.

I HAVE WITNESSED FIRSTHAND THE BOX GARDEN WHEN IT OPENED.

JUST BECAUSE OF THE DESIGN OF THE FACILITY, THE WINDROSE CONDOS, WHICH ARE RIGHT THERE ON THE NORTH SIDE, TAKE THE BRUNT.

THEY GET A LOT OF THE NOISE THAT COMES FROM THE BOX GARDEN, AND I HAVE WITNESSED ADJUSTMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN MADE TO THE NOISE LEVELS, BASED ON THAT, WHICH COMES FROM INPUT FROM THE CITY I'VE SEEN THAT MANAGED.

I WOULD SAY THE INVESTMENT THAT IS BEING MADE HERE IS TREMENDOUS TO KEEP THIS TOP SHELF FIRST CLASS, WHICH IS WHAT WE WANT IS VERY MUCH APPRECIATED THE ARTWORK, THE THOUGHTFULNESS, AND THE OPEN GREEN SPACE IS TREMENDOUS.

I WOULD ECHO YOUR COMMENTS ABOUT THE CITY BECAUSE HAVING LIVED THERE, WE'RE VERY EXCITED ABOUT THAT PARK AND INQUIRED MANY TIMES.

I THINK THAT WAS REALLY DONE AS PART OF THIS WHOLE DEVELOPMENT SO I THINK I WOULD JOIN YOU IN ASKING THAT THE CITY CONSIDER DEVELOPING THAT SOONER THAN LATER.

BECAUSE THERE'S NOT A LOT OF GREEN SPACE, THERE'S A PRIVATE PARK AS YOU GO UP INTO THE DEVELOPMENT BETWEEN THE WINDROSE CONDOS AND LEVEL 29.

[00:55:04]

THERE'S A PARK, BUT THAT'S A PRIVATE PARK SO PEOPLE THAT LIVE IN THAT AREA CAN'T ACCESS IT, IT'S ONLY FOR THE RESIDENTS OF THE WINDROSE CONDOS AND LEVEL 29 SO MORE GREEN SPACE IS AWESOME.

>> JUST A COUPLE OF COMMENTS MYSELF.

I THINK MR. BENDER HIT IT ON THE HEAD.

I THINK THE PEOPLE THAT GO TO LEGACY, AND AS I SAID, I LIVE IN THE DOWNTOWN AREA, AND THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN THE DOWNTOWN AREA, IN THE SAME WAY EXPECT A CERTAIN LEVEL OF VIBRANCY.

THAT'S WHY THEY MOVE THERE.

THEY MOVE THERE FOR THAT VIBE, FOR THAT ACTIVITY, FOR THAT LIVE MUSIC, FOR THOSE THINGS AND IF THEY'RE NOT LIKING THAT ENVIRONMENT, THAT'S NOT THE RIGHT NEIGHBORHOOD FOR THEM.

BUT PEOPLE MOVE THERE INTENTIONALLY FOR THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS.

I DON'T WORRY AT ALL ABOUT THE STAGE LIVING TWO BLOCKS FROM ONE MYSELF BECAUSE IT'S WAY MORE OF A BENEFIT THAN IT IS A LIABILITY IN MY BOOK.

I THINK THAT'S WHAT PEOPLE EXPECT, IT'S A GATHERING PLACE.

I'M EXCITED FOR YOU THAT YOU'RE PUTTING IT IN.

I THINK IT'LL BE A GREAT AMENITY FOR THE CENTER.

AS FAR AS THE SIGNAGE IS CONCERNED FROM MY PERSPECTIVE, I SEE THE LEGACY AREA AS THE MODERN DECONSTRUCTION OF THE SHOPPING MALL, AND THE INWARD FACING SIGNAGE IS NO DIFFERENT THAN YOU WOULD EXPECT IN ANY OTHER SHOPPING DISTRICT.

I FEEL CERTAIN THAT'S PROBABLY YOUR INTENT IS TO ENCOURAGE THAT ACTIVITY LEVEL AND KEEP THOSE TENANTS ENGAGED AND PROFITABLE AND RETURNING AND RENEWING THEIR LEASES SO I'M SUPPORTIVE OF THAT AS WELL.

OVERALL, I THINK MY PERSONAL OPINION IS IT'S A GREAT PACKAGE.

I THINK IT JUST WILL CONTINUE THE MOMENTUM THAT YOU'VE HAD UP TO NOW FOR MANY YEARS IN THE FUTURE.

WITH THAT SAID, COMMISSIONER OLLEY.

>> I WILL ADD ONE MORE THING AS SOMEBODY WHO HAS LOST HIS CAR PARKING IN ONE GARAGE AND TRYING TO FIND IT IN ANOTHER GARAGE UPDATE THE SIGNS, PLEASE.

I MOVE WE APPROVE AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 2A AS RECOMMENDED BY STAFF.

>> COMMISSIONER BENDER.

>> I WOULD SECOND THE MOTION.

>> WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND TO APPROVE ITEM 2A AS PRESENTED.

PLEASE VOTE. MOTION PASSES 7-0.

ITEM 2B.

>> COMMISSIONER BRONSKY.

>> I MOVE WE APPROVE AGENDA ITEM 2B AS RECOMMENDED BY STAFF.

>> COMMISSIONER LINGENFELTER.

>> SECOND THAT.

>> WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND ON ITEM 2B.

APPROVED 7-0.

CONGRATULATIONS. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

WE LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOU OVER THERE. THANK YOU.

>> ITEM 3.

[3. (JK) Public Hearing – Zoning Case 2025-002: Request to rezone from Research/Technology Center to Planned Development-Research/Technology Center to modify the permitted uses on 8.2 acres located at the northwest corner of Plano Parkway and Los Rios Boulevard. Project #ZC2025-002. Petitioner: IMAD, Inc. (Legislative consideration)]

>> AGENDA ITEM 3 IS A REQUEST TO RE ZONE FROM RESEARCH TECHNOLOGY CENTER TO PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT RESEARCH TECHNOLOGY CENTER TO MODIFY THE PERMITTED USES ON 8.2 ACRES LOCATED AT THE NORTHWEST CORNER OF PLANO PARKWAY AND LOS RIOS BOULEVARD.

PETITIONERS IMD INCORPORATED THIS ITEM AS FOR LEGISLATIVE CONSIDERATION.

MY NAME IS JOHN KIM, PLANNER WITH THE PLANNED DEPARTMENT. CAN YOU HEAR ME OKAY? GREAT.

TODAY WE HAVE A ZONING CASE AT THE NORTHWEST CORNER OF PLANO PARKWAY AND LOS RIOS BOULEVARD.

HERE IS THE ZONING EXHIBIT.

IT IS JUST FOR THIS SUBJECT PROPERTY.

THE ZONING REQUEST IS TO REZONE THE PROPERTY FROM RESEARCH TECHNOLOGY CENTER TO PLANNED DEPARTMENT RESEARCH TECHNOLOGY CENTER TO ALLOW COMMERCIAL AMUSEMENT WITH THE FOLLOWING STIPULATION.

AMUSEMENT COMMERCIAL INDOOR IS AN ADDITIONAL ALLOWED USE.

THE MAXIMUM SQUARE FOOTAGE OF INDOOR COMMERCIAL AMUSEMENT IS LIMITED TO 12,000 SQUARE FEET.

THE RESEARCH TECHNOLOGY CENTER DISTRICT OR RT IS INTENDED TO CREATE A LOW DENSITY EMPLOYMENT CENTER, CONSISTING OF OFFICE RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT FACILITIES AND LIMITED ASSEMBLY OPERATIONS, ACCOMMODATING SEVERAL USERS IN A CAMPUS ENVIRONMENT.

MANY OF THE PROPERTIES WITHIN RT ARE OFFICE WAREHOUSE MANUFACTURING USES AND OFTEN REQUIRE LARGER BUILDINGS THAT ARE TYPICAL WITHIN THE RT ZONING DISTRICT.

MANY OF THE PERMITTED USES DO UTILIZE THE LARGER BUILDINGS AND IT IS COMMON IN THE AREA.

[01:00:08]

THERE ARE OTHER USES WITHIN RT THAT ARE PERMITTED IN THE DISTRICT TO SUPPORT THE WORKLY ACTIVITIES OF THOSE EMPLOYEES WITHIN THE DISTRICT.

THE SECONDARY USES MAY INCLUDE BANKS, MEDICAL OFFICES, TAX SERVICES, HEALTH AND FITNESS CENTERS, AMONG OTHER USES, AND THESE USES ARE SUPPORTIVE OF THE PRIORITIES OF THE RT DISTRICT.

IN 2021, A SITE PLAN WAS APPROVED FOR FIVE BUILDINGS.

FOUR OF THEM WERE FOR OFFICE SHOW ROOM WAREHOUSE, AND ONE OF THEM WAS FOR A RESTAURANT.

IN 2024, BUILDING 5, AS YOU CAN SEE, ON THE SLIDE THERE IS THE BOTTOM LEFT BIGGEST BUILDING.

IT WAS REVISED AND APPROVED TO BE A DAYCARE CENTER, WHICH IS ALLOWED USE IN THE DISTRICT.

IN THIS PHOTO, YOU WILL SEE THREE OF THE DEVELOPED BUILDINGS.

THE TWO ALONG LOS RIOS ARE ALONG THE TOP HERE THEN THE MEDICAL OFFICE ALONG PLANO PARKWAY IS ON THE RIGHT SIDE THEN THE DAYCARE IS UNDER CONSTRUCTION IN THE YELLOW.

JUST TO NOTE THE BUILDING FOR THE DAYCARE WILL BE SMALLER THAN WHAT WAS APPROVED ON THE PLAN IN 2021.

THERE WILL BE A PARKING LOT WITH THE DAYCARE CENTER.

THE PETITIONER HAS INDICATED CHALLENGES IN FULLY LEASING THE SUITES UNDER THE RT ZONING.

STAFF HAVE PREVIOUSLY MET WITH THE APPLICANTS TO DISCUSS THE REZONING OF THE PROPERTY TO ALLOW MORE RETAIL RESTAURANTS AND SERVICE USES ON THE SITE.

STAFF WAS NOT SUPPORTIVE OF THE PROPOSALS DUE TO THE IMPACT ON THE INTEGRITY OF THE RT DISTRICT AND THE OVERABUNDANCE OF RETAIL IN THE CITY.

ALTHOUGH SYMPATHETIC TO THE PETITIONER'S CHALLENGES, THE PROPOSED REQUEST IS INCONSISTENT WITH THE PURPOSE AND INTENT OF THE RT DISTRICT.

IN THE RT DISTRICT, THE MEDIAN BUILDING SIZE IS 68,000 SQUARE FEET I DO WANT TO NOTE THAT ON THE SLIDE, IT DOES SAY AVERAGE, BUT IT IS MEDIAN.

THE SURROUNDING PROPERTIES BUILDING RANGE, SO THE DIRECT SURROUNDING PROPERTIES SHOWN IN THE PHOTO HERE.

THEY RANGE FROM 58,250 SQUARE FEET TO 135,000 SQUARE FEET AND ARE LEASED IN SOME CAPACITY.

THE CHALLENGES IN LEASING THE BUILDING ARE NOT A RESULT OF LOW DEMAND FOR USES ALLOWED WITHIN RT ZONING SO YOU CAN SEE COMPARED TO THE SITES ADJACENT, THIS SITE HAS 12,000 SQUARE FEET BUILDINGS AND 11,000 SQUARE FEET BUILDINGS THEY ARE MUCH SMALLER, BUT THEY ARE STILL IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE RT ZONING.

IN RT, THERE IS AN OCCUPANCY RATE OF NEARLY 92% IN A 2022 MARKET STUDY, CONDUCTED AS PART OF THE [INAUDIBLE] LINE STATION AREA PLAN.

RT PROPERTIES IN THE SHILOH ROAD STATION AREA HAD MODEST VACANCIES, STRONG MARKET DEMAND, AND REALISTIC EXPECTATIONS FOR GROWTH.

THIS ZONING REQUEST DOES NOT MEET THE PURPOSE OF ESTABLISHING PLANNED DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS.

PLANNED DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS SHOULD GUIDE THE FUTURE DEVELOPMENT OF THE CITY IN ACCORDANCE WITH A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND AIMED IN FINDING CREATIVE INNOVATIVE SOLUTIONS.

ONLY ADDING A RETAIL TYPE USE IS NOT AN INNOVATION AND MAY LEAD TO FUTURE REQUESTS FOR OTHER USES IN THIS AREA.

THE PRIMARY USE IN THIS AREA IS FOR EMPLOYMENT CENTERS, AND THEY ARE FOR CORPORATE OFFICE CAMPUSES, MEDICAL CENTERS, EDUCATIONAL FACILITIES, TECHNOLOGY CENTERS, AND RESEARCH FACILITIES.

LIMITED MANUFACTURING AND WAREHOUSE USES MAY BE ALLOWED TO SUPPORT THE EMPLOYMENT CENTERS.

THE PROPOSED USE IS NOT ALIGNED WITH THE PRIMARY AND ACCESSORY USES FOR THE EMPLOYMENT CENTER DISTRICT, OR DESIGNATION, SORRY.

HERE'S THE CONFORMANCE OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

IT DOES NOT MEET MANY OF THE REQUIREMENTS OR POLICIES.

FOR THE ZONING RESPONSES, WE HAD ONE LETTER FROM THE SUBJECT PROPERTY, WE RECEIVED NO OTHER RESPONSES.

>> IN SUMMARY, THE PURPOSE OF THE RT IS TO CREATE EMPLOYMENT CENTERS IN A CAMPUS ENVIRONMENT, AND THIS USE WOULD NOT BE MEETING THAT INTENT OF THE RT ZONING DISTRICT.

OCCUPANCY IS NOT AN ISSUE WITH THE RT DISTRICT AS THERE IS HIGH DEMAND AND STRONG TENANTS IN THE AREA.

THE REQUEST IS INCONSISTENT WITH THE PURPOSE OF A PLAN DEVELOPMENT, AND IS ALSO INCONSISTENT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

THE ITEM IS RECOMMENDED FOR DENIAL,

[01:05:01]

AND I'M AVAILABLE FOR QUESTIONS. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. ONE QUESTION REAL QUICK.

CAN YOU DEFINE COMMERCIAL INDOOR AMUSEMENT PER ZONING ORDINANCE, PLEASE?

>> YES. I THINK IT'S EASIER IF I DESCRIBE SOME OF THE USES.

IT IS FOR INDOOR ENTERTAINMENT, LIKE LEISURE ACTIVITIES.

THEY MAY BE LIKE BOWLING ALLEYS OR ARCADES, ESCAPE ROOMS, PICKLE BALLS, OR BUSINESSES SUCH AS LIKE PAINTING WITH A TWIST, SOMETHING LIKE THAT, FOR YOUR PAINTING AND DRINKING, I THINK.

IT'S THOSE INDOOR USES THAT ARE FOR ENTERTAINMENT ACTIVITIES.

>> THIS WOULD ALLOW VIRTUALLY ANY OF THOSE USES, NOT JUST THE USE REQUESTED, CORRECT?

>> THANK YOU. COMMISSIONERS, TECHNICAL QUESTIONS FOR THE STAFF, COMMISSIONER OLLEY.

>> JUST CLARIFICATION ON SUPPORTIVE USES IN THE RT DISTRICT.

IS IT A FAIR STATEMENT THAT DAYCARE, HEALTH AND FITNESS, MEDICAL, SECONDARY USES, AND INCIDENTAL RETAIL IS WRITTEN FOR THE RT DISTRICT IN ORDER TO SUPPORT THE BUSINESSES AND EMPLOYMENT WITHIN THOSE DISTRICTS, NOT AS A PRIMARY USE OF THOSE USES TO BE REDUNDANT?

>> YES. THOSE ARE SOME OF THE PERMITTED USES IN THE DISTRICT, AND THEY ARE SEEN AS SUPPORTIVE, SUCH AS THE DAYCARE THAT'S ON SITE OR THE HEALTH AND FITNESS CENTER.

THEY CAN BE SUPPORTIVE OF THE PRIMARY USES IN THE RT DISTRICT, AND SO YES, THOSE ARE.

>> ONE OTHER QUESTION, AS A PART OF THE ONE SILVER LINE IS COMPLETED AND WHAT HAVE YOU.

THIS WOULD ONLY DRIVE OCCUPANCY WITHIN THE RT DISTRICT AS WE CURRENTLY HAVE IT SCHEDULED, OR DO WE SEE IT HAVING AN OPPOSING EFFECT?

>> YOU'RE ASKING NOT THE ZONING REQUEST, BUT THE SHILOH ROAD [OVERLAPPING] IMPROVEMENT.

I BELIEVE SO. I BELIEVE THE STUDY DOES PROJECT A HEALTHY GROWTH IN THE AREA.

>> MR. BRONSKY, ONE QUESTION.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR PRESENTATION TODAY.

>> I WAS WONDERING IF YOU COULD CHARACTERIZE FOR ME THE DIFFERENCE THAT WE WOULD SEE IN THE LEVEL OF FULL-TIME EMPLOYMENT FOR THIS PROPOSED REQUEST AS IT COMPARES TO WHAT THE TRADITIONAL EMPLOYMENT VALUE THAT WE WOULD SEE FROM TRADITIONAL RT POSITION OR JOB?

>> I BELIEVE, YOU KNOW, IN THE STUDIES THAT THERE ARE PROJECTED HIGHER INCOMES FOR SOME OF THE MORE ADVANCED MANUFACTURING JOBS AND INDUSTRIAL JOBS LIKE THAT.

I CAN ONLY ASSUME THEY MIGHT BE HIGHER THAN A TYPICAL JOB AT A PLACE LIKE A PLAY CENTER.

I CAN'T PREDICT FULLY EXACTLY IF THAT WOULD BE THE CASE.

>> YOU'RE SAYING IN GENERAL, THE OPPORTUNITY FOR EMPLOYMENT THAT THE RT CENTER REPRESENTS WOULD BE HIGHER USED AS THE RT DESIGN AS OPPOSED TO WATERING DOWN FROM WHAT THE ALLOWED USES THAT WE'VE CREATED HERE ALREADY THAT WERE MEANT TO ENHANCE, BUT RATHER THAN EXPLORE OR GROW THE LIST EVEN FURTHER?

>> I BELIEVE SO, YES.

>> TO THAT EXTENT, I JUST RECENTLY WAS HAVING A CONVERSATION ABOUT THE LEVEL TO WHICH WE HAVE EMPLOYMENT IN THE CITY.

I KNOW WHEN I MOVED TO THE CITY OF PLANO, THE EMPLOYER SIDE OF THE TAX BASE WAS CLOSE TO 60% COVERING TAXES IN THE CITY AND 40% ON THE RESIDENTS.

AS WE SLOWLY MOVE AWAY FROM EMPLOYMENT DRIVEN THINGS SUCH AS THE RT CENTER AND WATERING IT DOWN, I WORRY THAT NOW WE ARE CLOSE TO 50% BALANCE THAT WE CONTINUE TO SWAY THE WRONG DIRECTION.

AND I THINK MAINTAINING THE INTEGRITY OF THE RT, AS YOU'VE RECOMMENDED SEEMS TO MAKE SENSE TO ME. THANK YOU.

>> OF COURSE.

>> MS. TONG.

>> THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. I'M JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE INDOOR AMUSEMENT USE OR COMMERCIAL AMUSEMENT USE AND USES LIKE THIS, THEY ALLOWED TO USE HEALTH AND FITNESS CENTERS OR TRADE SCHOOLS OR MASSAGE THERAPIES?

[01:10:09]

I THINK I MAY HAVE HEARD YOU SAYING THAT THE INDOOR AMUSEMENT USE IS A COMMERCIAL RETAIL.

BUT THESE USES THAT YOU JUST HAD, I DON'T KNOW WHY IT JUST MOVED AWAY.

CAN YOU BRING BACK THAT SLIDE FOR ALLOW THE USERS.

TO ME, THAT IF YOU ALLOW THEM TO DO A FITNESS CENTER OR HEALTH FITNESS CENTER, WOULD THAT BE SIMILAR TO HAVING A PICKLEBALL COURT OR HAVING A KIDS OWN PLAYGROUND? WOULDN'T THAT BE SIMILAR?

>> I THINK THE ZONING ORDINANCE DOES DEFINE SOME OF THOSE AS MORE SERVICE USES, WHEREAS THIS WOULD BE A RETAIL TYPE USE. THERE WE GO.

FOR EXAMPLE, I THINK THE DAYCARE FOR SOME EMPLOYEES THAT MIGHT BE WORKING IN THE AREA, THEY CAN DROP THEIR KIDS OFF THERE, AND CAN BE SUPPORTIVE DURING THE DAYTIME.

A LOT OF THE RT DISTRICT GOAL IS FOR THE WORK WEEK DAYTIME ACTIVITIES, AND SO THAT'S WHAT IT SUPPORTS.

I THINK WITH THIS CASE, THERE MIGHT BE MORE OF AN ATTEMPT FOR ACTIVITY AT ALL TIMES DURING THE WEEK.

I THINK THAT'S MAYBE THE DIFFERENCE IF THAT MAKES SENSE.

>> WELL, I'M THINKING IF THEY DO USE IT, OR THEY DID USE IT AS A PICKLEBALL COURT, WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THAT AND THE FITNESS CENTER?

>> I THINK THAT'S JUST HOW IT'S DETERMINED IN OUR ZONING ORDINANCE.

THAT MAYBE, CLEARED UP IN THE FUTURE.

BUT I THINK OUR ORDINANCE, AS WE HAVE UNDERSTOOD IT NOW, PICKLEBALL WOULD BE INTO THAT INDOOR AMUSEMENT AND NOT JUST HEALTH AND FITNESS.

>> THAT'S RETAIL?

>> HEALTHINESS CENTER IS LIKE LA FITNESS, A GYM, WHERE YOU GO DO SOME EXERCISE.

THE INDOOR COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY IS MEANT TO BE MORE ENTERTAINMENT FOCUSED.

THE PICKLEBALL, YOU'RE CHARGING A FEE, YOU'RE TYPICALLY GOING TO HAVE A BAR OR SOME TYPE OF FOOD SERVICE TO GO ALONG WITH THOSE ACTIVITIES, NOT LIKE JUST PLAYING PICKLEBALL FOR THE SAKE OF THE RECREATIONAL PURPOSES OF IT.

THAT'S THE DISTINCTION BETWEEN THOSE TWO USES, IF THAT MAKES SENSE.

>> I THINK I SEE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, WHERE YOU'RE GOING WITH THAT.

THAT WOULD BE CATEGORIZED AS RETAIL, AND THE FITNESS CENTER WOULDN'T BE RETAIL?

>> CORRECT. THEY'RE BOTH SERVICE USES, BUT ONE IS MORE RECREATIONAL AND ONE IS MORE ENTERTAINMENT FOCUSED.

THE ENTERTAINMENT, AGAIN, THINKING BOWLING ALLEYS, BINGO PARLORS, THESE ARE ALL THE USES THAT ARE CLASSIFIED AS INDOOR COMMERCIAL AMUSEMENT.

>> GOT YOU. THANK YOU.

>> THAT'S ALL YOUR QUESTIONS?

>> YEAH, THAT'S ALL.

>> COMMISSIONER BENDER.

>> THANK YOU, CHAIRMAN. I THINK YOU HAD MENTIONED, WAS IT 92% OCCUPANCY?

>> YES.

>> THANK YOU. I BELIEVE YOU SHOWED ON THE SCREEN THAT THE RT ZONING LIMITS ACCESSORY USES TO 10% OF THE FLOOR AREA OF THE SITE, IS THAT CORRECT?

>> COMMISSIONER BRUNO.

>> YES. LET ME GET TO THAT SIDE.

SOME USES SUCH AS A RESTAURANT.

THERE ARE SOME OTHER USES IN THE ORDINANCE, BUT THEY ARE LIST LIMITED TO 10% OF THE GROSS FLOOR AREA OF THE ENTIRE SITE.

WHETHER THAT'S ONE BUILDING OR MULTIPLE BUILDINGS, IT CAN'T BE MORE THAN 10%.

THERE IS A RESTRICTION FOR RESTAURANTS, I BELIEVE IF IT'S A STANDALONE BUILDING, IT DOES HAVE TO BE, I THINK 5,000 SQUARE FEET OR GREATER.

BUT OVERALL, IT DOES HAVE TO MEET THAT 10%.

I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT INCLUDES THE INCIDENTAL RETAIL OR RESTAURANT THAT SOME BUSINESSES MAY HAVE, BUT MORE STAND-ALONE RESTAURANTS, SO TO SPEAK.

>> IF THIS APPLICATION WERE TO BE APPROVED, WOULD IT STILL BE SUBJECT TO THE 10% LIMIT?

>> I THINK IF THIS APPLICATION WAS APPROVED, I THINK THE PRIMARY USE IN THIS EXAMPLE WOULD BE THE COMMERCIAL AMUSEMENT, AND SO IT WOULDN'T BE THAT RESTAURANT.

IF IT DID HAVE INCIDENTAL RESTAURANT OR RETAIL IN THERE, IT WOULD HAVE TO MEET ALL OF OUR REQUIREMENTS FOR INCIDENTAL RETAIL, WHICH BASICALLY MEANS LIKE NO SIGNAGE ON THE OUTSIDE AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

BUT I BELIEVE IT WOULD BE SEPARATED. THAT'S.

>> NO. NOT MY QUESTION. DOES THE APPLICATION SEEK TO ESTABLISH INDOOR AMUSEMENTS AS AN ALLOWED PRIMARY USE

[01:15:06]

FOR THE PROPERTY OR SIMPLY AS ONE OF THE ALLOWED ACCESSORY USES?

>> IT WOULD BE A PRIMARY USE.

>> THEN IT WOULD NOT BE SUBJECT TO THE 10% LIMIT?

>> I'M WONDERING WHETHER THE DAYCARE CENTER WOULD QUALIFY AS USING NO MORE THAN 10% OF THE GROSS FLOOR AREA OF THIS SITE?

>> THE DAYCARE CENTER IS ALLOWED BY THE ORDINANCE, AND SO THERE'S NO RESTRICTIONS.

>> AS A PRIMARY USE OR AS AN ACCESSORY?

>> AS A PRIMARY USE.

>> IT'S A PRIMARY USE.

>> YES.

>> SO IT'S NOT SUBJECT TO THE 10% EITHER?

>> NOW, LOOKING AT THE AERIAL VIEW AND HAVING DRIVEN THROUGH THAT GENERAL, THE RT AREA NUMEROUS TIMES, AND AS YOU POINTED OUT, IT STRIKES ME THAT THE AVERAGE BUILDING SIZE OF THE RT BUILDINGS THAT CURRENTLY EXIST ARE MUCH LARGER THAN THE BUILDINGS THAT ARE ON THE GROUND HERE NOW ON THIS SITE.

THE QUESTION I ASK IS, IS IT A REALISTIC EXPECTATION THAT THESE SMALL BUILDINGS ARE EVEN SUITABLE FOR RESEARCH AND TECHNOLOGY USE?

>> I THINK WHENEVER THESE BUILDINGS WERE INITIALLY APPROVED, THEY WERE ALL BUILDINGS 1, 02, 4, AND 5, WERE APPROVED AS OFFICE WAREHOUSE BUILDINGS.

I BELIEVE AT THE TIME, THERE MAY HAVE BEEN LESS OF A DEMAND FOR LARGER BUILDINGS.

I THINK IT WAS DURING COVID TIMES, AND SO THEY WANTED TO DO MORE STARTUPS AND BUSINESSES THAT MAY REQUIRE LESS SPACE THAN THE TYPICAL RT BUSINESS.

BUT I THINK THE RT DEMAND HAS SHOWN TO BE STRONG SINCE THAT TIME.

I THINK IS JUST A CHALLENGE FOR THE SITE BEING DESIGNED IN A MORE RETAIL COMMERCIAL TYPE DESIGN, WHERE YOU HAVE MULTIPLE SUITES AND ENTRANCES COMPARED TO A TYPICAL RT DESIGN.

>> WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS THE BUILDINGS AS BUILT TEND MORE TO LEND THEMSELVES TO PERHAPS A RETAIL USE THAN A RESEARCH AND TECHNOLOGY USE?

>> PERHAPS, I THINK SO.

>> BECAUSE OF THEIR SIZE AND THEIR DESIGN, IS THAT RIGHT?

>> I THINK SO.

>> WHICH PUTS US IN A QUANDARY.

ON THE ONE HAND, WE WANT TO PRESERVE OUR RESEARCH AND TECHNOLOGY DISTRICT.

ON THE OTHER HAND, WHAT ELSE CAN HE DO WITH THESE BUILDINGS? I DON'T KNOW.

>> IS THAT A QUESTION FOR THE STAFF OR YOU WANT TO SAVE THAT FOR THE BUSINESS?

>> A RHETORICAL QUESTION.

>> ALL RIGHT [LAUGHTER] COMMISSIONER OLLEY.

>> I WANT TO COME BACK IN MY HEAD, TWO SEPARATE THINGS, SUPPORTIVE USE FOR THE DISTRICT AND INCIDENTAL RETAIL SERVICE.

THE SUPPORTIVE USE IS A USE THAT ANCHORS EMPLOYMENT TO THE DISTRICT.

DAYCARE, BANK, HEALTH AND FITNESS.

I'VE WORKED IN VARIOUS CORPORATIONS THAT ARE ALMOST LIKE WE HAD A LIFETIME FITNESS, ESSENTIALLY, BUT IT WAS REALLY SO THAT THE EMPLOYEES DON'T GO HOME AND WE CAN GO WORK OUT AND COME BACK TO WORK AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

THE INCIDENTAL RETAIL, THE REASON WHY WE ARE CAPPING IT TO 10% OF THE BUILDING IS AGAIN, BECAUSE WE ARE TRYING TO DRIVE BEHAVIOR THAT ANCHORS AGAIN EMPLOYMENT TO THE DISTRICT OR TO THE SITE PLAT.

TOYOTA, I BELIEVE, HAS IT.

THEY HAVE A WALMART OR SOMETHING IN CAMPUS, SO THAT YOU DON'T HAVE TO GET OUT OF CAMPUS TO GO BUY STUFF.

WHAT THIS IS ASKING IS FOR A RETAIL USE TO BECOME A PRIMARY USE DISCONNECTED FROM ANCHORING, THE DISTRICT.

THAT'S WHY I THINK THIS DOESN'T VIBE WITH WHAT WE INTENDED THAT PARCEL OF LAND TO DO.

>> IS THERE A QUESTION?

>> I MIGHT ADD IN.

I THINK RETAIL AND RESTAURANT WAS SPECIFICALLY LIMITED TO 10% TO PREVENT THE CONSTRUCTION OF RETAIL SHOPPING CENTERS IN THIS DISTRICT BECAUSE YOU COMBINE THOSE USES THAT YOU MIGHT SEE IN A SHOPPING CENTER WITH MORE RETAIL AND RESTAURANT, YOU END UP GETTING STRIP SHOPPING CENTERS.

THAT'S NOT THE INTENT OF THE RT DISTRICT.

>> COMMISSIONER BRONSKY, QUESTION FOR THE STAFF?

>> WITH THE SIZE THAT THESE BUILDINGS ARE, AND WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

>> WHEN I THINK BACK TO A VOTE THAT I MADE ON A PARCEL

[01:20:03]

THAT WE NEEDED TO BE A LITTLE MORE PATIENT WITH THE FRYES DEVELOPMENT PARCEL THAT IS COMING BACK TO US NOW.

MR. KIM, WOULD YOU SAY THAT BY LOOKING AT THE STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION, ARE YOU SUGGESTING THAT MAYBE WE BE A LITTLE BIT MORE PATIENT, THAT THERE'S A GOOD POTENTIALITY WITH A 92% OCCUPANCY RATE THAT THIS PARTICULAR BUILDING COULD VERY WELL BE FILLED WITH SOMETHING THAT WOULD BE OF A GREATER LEVEL OF EMPLOYMENT AND THAT WOULD BE ALIGNED WITH WHAT THE RT DISTRICT IS SUPPOSED TO HAVE IN IT.

>> I DON'T KNOW THAT I CAN SAY FOR SURE, BUT I DO THINK THERE ARE OTHER POSSIBILITIES, SUCH AS THE USES LISTED ON THIS SLIDE HERE THAT HAVE TRADITIONALLY TAKEN ON BUILDINGS OF THIS FORMAT BEFORE.

MAYBE OVER TIME, THERE MAY BE DEVELOPMENTS IN MANUFACTURING OR OFFICE SPACE WAREHOUSE SPACE THAT MAY UTILIZE THESE BUILDINGS, AND THAT IS CERTAINLY A POSSIBILITY.

BUT I THINK AT THIS TIME, I THINK WE ARE JUST RECOMMENDING THAT THE DENIAL TO RESPECT THE INTENT AND PURPOSE OF THE RT DISTRICT, AND SO JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE PRESERVING THE INTENDED USE OF THE PROPERTY IN THE RT DISTRICT.

>> TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, I DON'T THINK STAFF IS SUGGESTING THAT THESE BUILDINGS ARE SUITABLE FOR OFFICE SHOWROOM WAREHOUSE.

I THINK THOSE CONCERNS WERE RAISED WHEN THE ORIGINAL SITE PLAN WAS APPROVED, BUT THE BUILDINGS MEET ZONING AND SO THEY WERE APPROVED.

THE CONCERN HERE IS THAT THE INVESTMENT WAS PUT INTO BUILDINGS THAT CANNOT BE OCCUPIED, AND THAT WAS A DECISION BY THE PROPERTY OWNER OF THE INVESTOR.

IS NOT A PROBLEM WITH THE RT DISTRICT.

IS IT LIKELY THAT THE BUILDINGS MAY REMAIN VACANT? THERE'S A POSSIBILITY THAT THAT HAPPENS IF THIS IS NOT APPROVED.

HOWEVER, THE REQUEST THAT'S BEING SOUGHT HERE IS A RESULT OF THOSE DECISIONS AND NOT OF THE ZONING THAT'S IN PLACE TODAY.

THE ZONING ITSELF IS NOT LEADING TO THE VACANCY.

>> THAT'S WHAT I WAS LOOKING AT. LAST QUESTION.

WHENEVER I LOOK AT THE CONFORMANCE TO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, WHICH EVERYBODY KNOWS IS IMPORTANT TO ME, COULD YOU DISCUSS JUST FOR A MOMENT? I SEE ABOUT SIX OR EIGHT DIFFERENT PLACES WHERE THIS PARTICULAR OPTION WOULD BE NOT IN CONFORMANCE WITH THE PLAN, EVERYTHING FROM THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP ON DOWN?

>> OF COURSE, I'LL TRY MY BEST.

>> THANK YOU. AS FAR AS THE DESCRIPTIONS AND PRIORITY OF THE FUTURE LAND USE, IT IS THE ENTERTAINMENT CENTERS, WHICH IS, AGAIN, THE PURPOSE IS TO CREATE JOB CENTERS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

IT DOES NOT MEET THAT REQUIREMENT.

THE REDEVELOPMENT OF REGIONAL TRANSPORTATION QUARTERS POLICY.

I DON'T KNOW AT THIS TIME, BUT MAYBE WITH ADDITIONAL REVIEW, MR. BELL, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU HAVE COMMENT ON THAT ONE.

>> I COULD SUM IT UP ALL THOSE POLICIES BETWEEN REDEVELOPMENT OF REGIONAL TRANSPORTATION AND THE HOUSING VALUE RETENTION ANALYSIS ALL SPEAK TO THE ABUNDANCE OF RETAIL AND THE AVOIDANCE OF PROLIFERATING ADDITIONAL RETAILS THAT IT LEADS TO ADDITIONAL UNDERPERFORMING SITES AS A RESULT OF THAT.

THIS WOULD SIMPLY BE ADDING ADDITIONAL RETAIL IN AREAS THAT WE ALREADY DON'T WANT RETAIL AND CREATING SOMETHING YET MORE OUT OF CONFORMANCE WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN THAT WE PUT SO MUCH TIME AND EFFORT INTO CREATING.

>> I THINK THE CITY HAS LONG-STANDING POLICIES ABOUT THE CONCERNS OF TOO MUCH RETAIL.

IT'S NOT THAT NEW RETAIL IS NOT SUCCESSFUL, IT'S THAT IT POACHES FROM THE EXISTING RETAIL, WHICH LEADS TO FURTHER DECLINE IN THOSE EXISTING SHOPPING CENTERS.

>> FOLLOWING UP ON SOMETHING YOU SAID.

ONE QUESTION REAL QUICK ABOUT THE INTENT OF THE RT DISTRICT.

IF YOU CAN GO BACK TO THAT SLIDE WITH ALL THE AUXILIARY USES RIGHT THERE. THANKS.

>> THIS ONE.

>> COMMISSIONER OLLEY TALKED ABOUT THIS BRIEFLY, BUT I'M GOING TO SIMPLIFY IT FOR ME.

THE WAY I READ THE ALLOWED USES IS IN MY MIND, SOMETHING I CAN RUN, TAKE CARE OF DURING MY LUNCH BREAK, OR SOMETHING I CAN TAKE ADVANTAGE OF BEFORE OR AFTER WORK.

[01:25:04]

I DON'T HAVE TO GO ALL THE WAY HOME OR GO WORK OUT BEFORE WORK, OR I CAN GO WORK OUT AT LUNCH OR I CAN DROP MY KIDS OFF NEAR IN PLACE OF EMPLOYMENT, OR I CAN RUN SEE MY ACCOUNTANT DURING MY BREAK AND GET MY TAXES DONE.

IT'S SUPPORTING THE EMPLOYMENT IN THAT DISTRICT.

AM I OVERSIMPLIFYING THAT, OR IS THAT THE INTENT OF THE ACCESSORY USES IN THE RT DISTRICT?

>> YES, I BELIEVE THAT IS ACCURATE.

>> THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? I'LL OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING.

[NOISE] I BELIEVE THE APPLICANT IS HERE, IS THAT CORRECT?

>> DO THE APPLICANT LIKE TO COME FORWARD AND GIVE US YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS, PLEASE?

I'M PART OF THE OWNERSHIP FOR THIS SITE HERE IN THE RT DISTRICT.

MY NAME IS AMIR HAMZA.

WE STARTED THIS SITE RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF COVID.

AS EVERYBODY KNOWS, EVERYBODY WAS DOWNSIZING.

RETAIL WAS DOWNSIZING, WAREHOUSES WERE DOWNSIZING.

MEDICAL WERE DOWNSIZING.

EVERYTHING WAS TRYING TO DOWNSIZE AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE.

WE DECIDED TO GIVE SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT IN THE RT DISTRICT.

WE'RE LIKE, HEY, THERE'S A LOT OF MOM AND POP BUSINESSES THAT WANT TO OPEN UP, AND MAYBE THEY DON'T WANT TO 10,000, 15,000, 20,000 SQUARE FEET OF SPACE, AND THEY WANT TO OPEN SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT SMALLER AND START THEIR BUSINESS.

WE'RE LIKE, THIS IS THE OPPORTUNITY FOR THESE COMPANIES THAT MAY HAVE HAD MORE SPACE OR WANTING TO LESS SPACE TO BE ABLE TO TRANSITION INTO A FACILITY LIKE OURS.

UNFORTUNATELY, WE STARTED LEASING IN 2021.

WE HAVE BEEN ON EVERY CO-STAR, LOOP NET, EVERYTHING THAT YOU COULD THINK OF ON THE TOP OF EVERY SINGLE PAGE AND PAYING THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS EVERY SINGLE MONTH TO BE ON THE TOP.

I HAVE NOT GOTTEN MUCH RT DISTRICT USERS.

MAYBE IT'S BY DESIGN, BUT EVEN WITH THE 12,000 SQUARE FOOT BUILDING IN TOTAL, I STILL HAVE NOT GOTTEN ONE THAT I'M ABLE TO BE LIKE, HEY, LET'S GO, LET'S MAKE A DEAL, OR WE WOULD HAVE MADE A DEAL WITH HIM, AND WE WOULD NOT BE IN THIS POSITION HERE TODAY.

WE HAVE TRIED OUR BEST TO MAKE DEALS THAT FIT INTO THE RT DISTRICT USERS.

BUT SAYING THAT, THERE'S ALWAYS THIS 92% OCCUPANCY OF THIS 2022 STUDY, AND NOT TO DISREGARD THAT, BUT IF YOU EVER ACTUALLY DRIVE ON RT DISTRICT, YOU CAN NOTICE THAT, HEY, THERE'S TONS OF PLACES FOR LEASE.

EXCUSE ME, THERE'S QUITE A BIT OF SQUARE FOOTAGE.

IF YOU JUST TAKE IT TO THE ACCOUNT, IT JUST SEEMS ODD THAT THERE'S A HIGH DEMAND WHEN I'M HAVING BROKERS AND EVERYBODY TRYING TO LEASE MY SPACES, AND IT'S NOT HAPPENING.

SAYING THAT WE ARE JUST A LITTLE BIT OF HISTORY ABOUT US.

WE'RE A FAMILY-OWNED BUSINESS.

WE'VE OPERATED ACTUALLY IN PLANO ON SPRING CREEK AND ALMA WHOLE LIFE.

WE ARE IN THE RETAIL SIDE.

WE DO HAVE SOME RETAIL SHOPPING STRIPS, AND WE ARE HANDS-ON IN EVERYTHING THAT WE DO.

WE ARE DILIGENT.

WE BUILD EVERYTHING FROM THE GROUND UP, AND WE TRY TO WORK HARD TO BRING A COMMUNITY INTO OUR SPACES.

WE DON'T LEASE TO WHOEVER.

WE WANT TO BUILD A SHOPPING CENTER OR IN THIS CASE, BUILDINGS THAT MESH TOGETHER AND THAT WORK TOGETHER IN ITS WHOLE ENTIRETY.

UNFORTUNATELY, AS OF NOW, I'M ABOUT 50% LEASE, AND THAT INCLUDES THAT DAYCARE SCHOOL THAT'S ABOUT TO COME UP.

IF YOU TAKE THE DAYCARE SCHOOL OUT OF IT, I AM IN THE 30, MAYBE 25-30% LEAST WITH EVERYTHING THAT I HAVE.

NOT TO GET VERY PERSONAL, BUT WE HAVE SPENT $11 MILLION ON THIS PROJECT THUS FAR, AND WE'RE ABOUT TO SPEND A FEW MORE WITH THE DAYCARE AND A FEW MORE CONTINUING THIS PROJECT AND TO BE ABLE TO PRESENT SOMETHING AND HAVE A SOLID PROFILE HERE IN A PROPERTY HERE.

THE ISSUE IS, AGAIN, THE MEDICAL OFFICE USERS ARE NOT LEASING.

IT'S A LITTLE BIT TOO INDUSTRIAL FOR THEM TO COME.

EVEN THOUGH WE HAVE A COUPLE OF MEDICAL USERS, THEY'RE NOT COMING.

WE HAVE TRIED FROM DIFFERENT LABS TO COMPOUND PHARMACIES, YOU NAME IT.

WE HAVE TRIED THAT, AND THEY ARE NOT COMING.

WE HAVE GIVEN THEM SO MUCH IN TI MONEY, ALMOST BEGGING THEM TO COME AND LEASE FROM US, AND STILL, IT'S NOT HAPPENING.

NOT JUST ON THE MEDICAL SIDE, ON THE OFFICE SIDE, A LOT OF PEOPLE, AS Y'ALL KNOW, OFFICE IS DOWN, EVERYWHERE YOU CAN GET OFFICE SPACE, PRETTY MUCH ANYWHERE YOU LIKE.

THERE'S NOT A LOT OF NEW COMPANIES THAT ARE WILLING TO SPEND SOME MONEY ON BUILDING THEIR OFFICE SPACE AND SO WE'RE IN A PICKLE NOW.

WITH ALL THE MONEY WE HAVE SPENT, WE HAVE THE DAYCARE GROUP, AND IT NEEDS A SUPPORT, IT NEEDS SOMETHING THAT NOT ONLY THAT PEOPLE IN THE NEARBY BUSINESSES CAN DROP OFF THEIR KIDS, BUT ALSO NEEDS SOME DAILY TRAFFIC INTO THE CENTER.

IF YOU COME TO MY CENTER RIGHT NOW, IT IS VACANT, YOU'LL SEE A COUPLE OF CARS PARKED WITH JUST THE TENANTS,

[01:30:01]

AND THEY'RE TRYING TO MAKE IT AS BEST THEY CAN.

THAT'S THE BIGGEST THING IS THEY NEED A LITTLE BIT OF MORE FOOT TRAFFIC JUST TO GET SOME EYES ONTO THE CENTER.

SAYING THAT THIS CONCEPT AND THE REASON WHY THIS HYPER KIDS INDOOR PLAYGROUND, AND REALLY, THAT'S THE ONLY USE THAT I'M GOING TO USE IT.

I'M NOT GOING TO PUT PICKLE BALL, I'M NOT GOING TO PUT A HOCKEY.

I'M GOING TO DO ANY BOWLING ALLEY.

I NEED THIS INDOOR PLAYGROUND FOR THESE TODDLERS, BECAUSE NUMBER ONE, THERE'S A LACK OF IT IN THE PLANO MARKET AND THERE'S A COUPLE OF OTHER REASONS AS WELL BECAUSE THERE'S NOTHING LIKE IT HERE, FOR EXAMPLE, THEY ARE THE ONLY INDOOR PLAYGROUND THAT TAKES ABOUT 12,000 SQUARE FEET.

THEY ACTUALLY WANTED CLOSE TO 15,000 SQUARE FEET.

NORMAL RETAIL SHOPPING CENTERS WILL NOT WORK WITH RENTAL RATES AROUND 25, 30 BUCKS A SQUARE FOOT, BECAUSE THEY'RE TRYING TO BE AFFORDABLE FOR EVERYBODY.

WHEN YOU GO TO YOUR NORMAL JUMP STREET, YOU'RE SPENDING ABOUT $20, $25 PER CHILD.

BUT WHEN YOU'RE COMING TO THIS INDOOR PLAYGROUND, YOU'RE SPENDING AROUND 8-$10 PER CHILD.

THERE'S NO FOOD. THERE'S NO KITCHEN.

THERE'S NO GREASE STRAP. THERE'S NONE OF THAT.

IT'S JUST A PLACE FOR THESE YOUNG TODDLERS CAN COME IN, GET A WORKOUT, GET EXERCISE, HAVE POTENTIALLY A PARTY, AND ALSO SUPPORT THE EXHILIAT BUSINESSES THAT ARE THERE.

I UNDERSTAND AND THE REST OF MY TEAM CAN ATTACK MORE ON THE TECHNICALITY OF EVERYTHING, BUT JUST COMING ON THE BUSINESS SIDE OF WHERE WE ARE AT, AND I HOPE ALL CAN ALSO TAKE THAT INTO ACCOUNT.

BUT AS OF RIGHT NOW, I HAVE CELEBRATE, I HAVE THIS POTENTIAL HYPER KIDS IF THIS GOES THROUGH, AND I HAVE AN URGENT CARE PEDIATRICS THAT COULD ALSO SUPPORT THIS, AND I ALSO HAVE AN INTERNALIST.

I DO HAVE A HEALTH AND FITNESS USER AND THAT'S PRETTY MUCH ABOUT IT, AND THE REST OF THE SPACES ARE VACANT.

I JUST DON'T WANT IT TO BE VACANT, ESPECIALLY WITH THESE BEAUTIFUL BUILDINGS AS YOU COULD SEE AND SEE IF WE COULD DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.

I'LL PASS IT ON TO CARL.

>> CARL CRAWLEY 2201 MAIN STREET, DALLAS, TEXAS.

AS AMIR SAID, I'D LOVE TO JUST SAY, THE ONLY USE FOR THIS INDOOR WE DON'T WANT A BOWLING ALLEY, WE DON'T WANT A SKATING RINK IS AN INDOOR CHILDREN'S PLAYGROUND.

NOW THAT'S A USE WE'D HAVE TO DEFINE IN THE PD.

I THINK IT COULD BE DONE.

BUT HYPERKIDS IS A NATIONAL BRAND.

THIS WOULD BE THE FIRST PLACE PRETTY MUCH OUT OF THE EAST COAST, I THINK THEY'VE GOT SOME IN OHIO, BUT I STILL CONSIDER THAT EAST COAST FOR US HERE, BUT IT WOULD BE THE FIRST PLACE IN TEXAS.

THEY HAVE SOME COMING SOON IN HOUSTON, BUT, OF COURSE, WE'D RATHER HAVE SOMETHING HERE FIRST, INSTEAD OF HOUSTON.

I THINK WE ALL AGREE ON THAT.

BUT SO WE WOULD BE WILLING TO LIMIT TO THAT USE.

WITH THE DAYCARE NEXT DOOR, WE THINK IT'S A SYNERGY.

IF YOU'D LOOKED AT SOME OF THE AERO PHOTOS THAT YOUR PLANNERS SHOWED, A LOT OF THOSE PARKING LOTS AROUND US ARE VACANT.

I'VE BEEN OUT THERE A FEW TIMES ON SATURDAY AND SUNDAY.

THE BIG INDUSTRIAL USE ACROSS THE STREET ON SATURDAY AND SUNDAY IS CRICKETS.

THEY'RE NOT A 24 HOUR FACILITY OF SEVEN DAYS A WEEK.

WE THEN ADD SOMETHING TO THIS INTERSECTION, THIS AREA THAT IS NOW A SEVEN DAY USE.

IT PLAYS OFF OF THE DAYCARE.

THE DAYCARE OBVIOUSLY SEES THIS FACILITY.

THE PEOPLE BRINGING THE DAYCARE.

THERE COULD BE WORKERS AROUND THERE.

IF YOU LOOK AT YOUR AERIAL, AND I THINK I'VE GOT AN AERIAL A LITTLE FORWARD, BUT YOU'VE SEEN IT.

THE RESIDENTIAL IS A COUPLE OF 100 YARDS AWAY, AND MOST OF IT TO THE EAST IS ALL RESIDENTIAL.

THIS IS AT THE VERY EDGE OF THAT PORTION OF THE RT DISTRICT.

THIS NEIGHBORHOOD IS AT THE FRINGE OF THE RT, AND THEN WE GET INTO A NEIGHBORHOOD, IF YOU LOOKED AT YOUR COMP PLAN, IT EVEN SHOWED THAT AS A NEIGHBORHOOD AREA THERE.

THIS IS GOING TO SERVE THAT AREA, AND IT'S GOING TO SERVE A GREATER PLANO AREA.

WE THINK IT IS A CENTERGY FOR WHAT WE'RE BUILDING, AND WE ARE BUILDING THE DAYCARE CENTER.

IT'S NOT A OCCUPIED SPACE.

IT'S A WHOLE NEW SPACE.

IT'S A NATIONAL CELEBRATES, IT'S A NATIONAL ORGANIZATION THAT DOES CHILDCARE.

THEY FEED OFF OF THAT CORPORATE STUFF.

WE HAVE REPRESENTED THEM IN SOME CORPORATE LOCATIONS, BUT THEY ALSO ARE USED FOR THE NEIGHBORHOODS AND THE SCHOOLS IN THE AREA.

WE THINK THIS PROVIDES THAT ONE ADDITIONAL USE THAT MAKES THAT A INTERSECTION THAT IS OCCUPIED SEVEN DAYS A WEEK.

NOW, IS THAT GOING TO CREATE A GIANT TRAFFIC GENERATOR? NO, THIS IS NOT A GIANT TRAFFIC GENERATOR? THE DAYCARE IS NOT OPEN ON SATURDAY AND SUNDAY, BUT THIS WOULD BE, AND THEN COULD OCCUPY THAT SPACE AND THE PARKING AND THE OTHER THINGS THAT WOULD BE VACANT JUST LIKE ANY OTHER RT USE USUALLY ON SATURDAY AND SUNDAY.

[01:35:01]

WE THINK THIS PLAYS AN IMPORTANT ROLE IN THAT INTERSECTION IN THE WHOLE AREA AND IT'S AN OPPORTUNITY FOR PLANO TO GET THIS NATIONAL BRAND, THE FIRST ONE IN THE STATE OF TEXAS.

I'VE GOT ONE OTHER SPEAKER. THANK YOU.

WEST HAS CHILDREN.

MY CHILDREN ARE BIGGER THAN I AM, SO THEY [LAUGHTER].

>> WEST ALBOT 2201 MAIN STREET, DALLAS, TEXAS.

YES, I DO HAVE A 2-YEAR-OLD, AND THESE ARE WHERE I SPEND MY WEEKENDS NOW.

I DON'T GO TO BOWLING ALLEYS OR ANYWHERE FUN.

I GO TO KIDS' FOCUS EVENTS, MOSTLY PARKS AND ASI A COUPLE OF WEEKENDS AGO, AND THEN A PLACE STREET DOWN IN MIDOTHIAN.

I LIVE IN FORT WORTH, AND UNFORTUNATELY, THERE'S REALLY NONE OF THESE PLACES AROUND ME.

I HAVE TO GO OVER MULTIPLE COUNTY LINES TO GET THEM.

WE HAVE BIRTHDAY PARTIES THAT I HAVE TO TRAVEL IMMENSE DISTANCES TO TO GO TO ON A SATURDAY MORNING AT 10:00 A.M. AND WE'RE THERE FOR ABOUT AN HOUR OR TWO.

IF I HAD SOMETHING LIKE THIS CLOSE TO MY NEIGHBORHOOD, I WOULD BE ECSTATIC.

MY DAUGHTER DOES GO TO DAYCARE, AND SHE STILL COMES HOME OF BALL OF ENERGY.

SHE'S OVER A LITTLE OVER 2-YEARS-OLD, AND I LIKE THESE PLACES BECAUSE THEY WEAR OUT.

IT'S NICE, IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD SPECIFICALLY TO THE SOUTHWEST.

THEY HAVE A COMMUNITY POOL, BUT I NOTICED THAT THAT NEIGHBORHOOD DOESN'T HAVE MULTIPLE AREAS FOR CHILDREN TO PLAY IN.

THIS IS THAT AREA TO FIT THAT NEED.

THAT'S SOMETHING THAT I WOULD REALLY RELISH AS A PARENT FOR MY 2-YEAR-OLD TO HAVE SOMEWHERE TO GO WHERE I CAN ENTER AT A LOW COST. IT'S OPEN TO EVERYBODY.

I DON'T HAVE TO RESERVE IT FOR 2 HOURS.

THE ASI I WAS AT WAS IN ARLINGTON.

IT WAS A PRIVATE BIRTHDAY PARTY, AND IT WAS VERY EXPENSIVE.

IT WAS A 3-YEAR-OLD, SO WE WERE INVITED AS A 2-YEAR-OLD TO FILL THE SPACE ALE BIT JUST BECAUSE OF THE COST.

HAVING A PLACE LIKE THIS, THAT'S A LOWER COST WHERE YOU CAN GO, HAVE YOUR CHILD BURN OUT A LITTLE BIT OF ENERGY FOR AN HOUR, 2 HOURS, THREE, GO GET LUNCH, EVEN COME BACK.

THAT'S SOMETHING THAT'S REALLY ATTRACTIVE TO ME AS A PARENT THAT I WOULD PERSONALLY SEE AS A BENEFIT TO THIS AREA AND NOT A DETRIMENT.

WE'RE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS, BUT I'LL GO THROUGH THE SIDES, BUT I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S ANYTHING ELSE THAT WOULD BE SPECIFICALLY COVERED, BUT THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

>> COMMISSION, QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? COMMISSIONER BRONSKY.

>> I DO. I'VE GOT A COUPLE.

YOU MENTIONED OPERATING AT THE CORNER OF CUSTER AND ALMA.

WHICH CORNER IS THAT?

>> SPRING CREEK AND ALMA.

>> INDIA BAZAAR CENTER, CICIS PIZZA, AUTOZONE CENTER, TWO-STOREY.

>> THAT SOUTHEAST CORNER, CORRECT?

>> CORRECT. THERE WAS A OLD BBVA THAT WAS SOLD RECENTLY AS WELL.

THEY CLOSED DOWN, AND NOW IT'S ANOTHER BANK.

OZK IS OPENING THAT UP IN THE FUTURE.

>> JUST THINKING ABOUT THE CONDITION OF THAT PARKING IN THAT CORNER AS I GOT A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS.

LET ME ASK YOU THIS. WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THE RT DISTRICT AS IT'S SET UP, IS IT DESIGNED FOR CHILD ENTERTAINMENT?

>> I WOULD SAY, TO BE HONEST, NO, IT'S NOT.

>> IS IT DESIGNED FOR FOOT TRAFFIC?

>> IT DEPENDS ON IF YOU WANT A LIVELY PLANO STREET.

ALL THESE BUSINESSES THAT HAVE 80,000 SQUARE FEET, THEY OBVIOUSLY HAVE EMPLOYEES.

IF YOU LOOK AT THE PARKING, IT'S PRETTY VACANT EVEN DURING THE WEEK.

IT'S NOT LIKE THE FOOT TRAFFIC NEEDS TO OBVIOUSLY BE THERE.

TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, MAYBE THE AMOUNT OF FOOT TRAFFIC A RETAIL WOULD HAVE IS NOT NECESSARY.

I HAVE OTHER RETAIL CENTERS THAT BRING IN OVER A MILLION PEOPLE A YEAR.

>> I GUESS MY QUESTION THOUGH IS, IS THE RT DISTRICT DESIGNED TO HAVE RETAIL FOOT TRAFFIC?

>> WELL, YOU ALL DESIGNED A 10% IN THAT, AND YOU ALSO HAVE OTHER USERS LIKE HEALTH AND FITNESS IN THERE AS WELL.

>> GOOD. I'M GLAD YOU BROUGHT THAT UP BECAUSE THAT'S MY NEXT QUESTION.

THOSE OTHER USERS THAT YOU JUST MENTIONED, WHAT'S THEIR PURPOSE?

>> WELL, THE RESTAURANT, FOR EXAMPLE, IS WHEN PEOPLE ARE OFF ON THEIR LUNCH BREAK, THEY CAN GO GRAB SOME FOOD.

>> THOSE OTHER USERS, THEY'RE DESIGNED TO AUGMENT OR HELP THE RT DISTRICT OR THE PEOPLE THAT ARE EMPLOYED THERE, CORRECT?

>> BUT WHAT I HEARD YOU GUYS SAY, THAT WHAT YOU'RE ADDING HERE IS ACTUALLY DESIGNED TO AUGMENT NOT THE RT DISTRICT, BUT THE DAYCARE THAT YOU'RE PUTTING IN. IS THAT CORRECT?

>> IT'S REALLY FOR THE WHOLE SITE AND FOR THE WHOLE CITY OF PLANO, BECAUSE AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE CAN EASILY HAVE BEAUTIFUL VACANT BUILDINGS JUST STAYING THERE AND BEING VACANT.

>> I UNDERSTAND THAT.

>> THAT'S REALLY THE POINT HERE THAT WE'RE TRYING TO GET TO, IS THAT SURE, WE MAY NOT BE IN FULLY COMPLIANCE WITH THE RT.

[01:40:02]

WE'RE PAST THAT. WE COMPLETELY UNDERSTAND THAT.

IT'S THE POINT THAT, HEY, WE ARE BUYING HERE, AND IF WE DON'T DO SOMETHING, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE VACANT BUILDINGS THAT ARE JUST GOING TO SIT LIKE THIS.

REALLY, IT'S NOT LIKE MORE TENANTS ARE GOING TO COME WHEN THESE TENANTS OR THEIR LEASES ARE OVER, AND THEY'RE NOT DOING SO WELL, THEY'RE GOING TO LEAVE.

YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE ACRES OF SITE ON A CORNER OF PLANO PARKWAY IN LOS RIOS THAT'S GOING TO BE VACANT.

I'M NOT TRYING TO CHANGE IT INTO A RETAIL STRIP CENTER. THAT'S NOT MY GOAL.

I'M JUST ASKING A LITTLE BIT OF A HELP TO TRY TO GET THIS ONE USER IN SO THAT I CAN THEN FILL IN THE REST WITH RT USERS.

IT'S NOT LIKE I'M ASKING THE WHOLE SITE TO BE A SHOPPING CENTER.

I'M ASKING ONE SPECIFIC BUILDING OUT OF FIVE BUILDINGS, ONE OF THEM TO BE MORE SPECIFICALLY TOWARDS THIS.

THAT'S REALLY JUST TO HELP THE OVERALL SITE IN ORDER FOR IT TO BE LEASED.

>> I HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF.

>> LET'S FINISH WITH THE APPLICANT.

WE'LL COME BACK TO THAT AFTER WE FINISH WITH KERRY.

>> NOT TO SOUND LIKE I'M PILING ON, MORE OF A QUESTION TO ORIENT MYSELF.

>> COMMISSIONER OLLEY.

WHEN DID YOU PURCHASE THE SITE?

>> WE PURCHASED THE SITE, I WOULD SAY, CLOSE TO 10 YEARS AGO NOW, OR 8-10 YEARS AGO, PROBABLY. CLOSE TO THAT.

>> IT WAS ZONED RT BY THEN?

>> YES. AT THAT TIME, RT WAS STRUGGLING TREMENDOUSLY.

>> UNDERSTOOD. BUT YOU PURCHASED WITH THE UNDERSTANDING OF THE INTENT THE CITY HAD FOR THAT DISTRICT.

IS THAT A FAIR STATEMENT?

>> TO BE HONEST, AND IF I COULD BE AS OPEN AS POSSIBLE, THE PURCHASE WAS NOT DONE CORRECTLY FROM THE BEGINNING BECAUSE OF THE ZONING.

THE PEOPLE WHO PURCHASED THE SITE DID NOT HAVE MUCH REAL ESTATE KNOWLEDGE TO LOOK TO FUTURE ZONING.

I'M SORRY TO SAY THAT, BUT IT IS TRUE.

>> THAT'S YOU, THE PURCHASER?

>> CORRECT, BEFORE MY TIME.

YES. THAT'S WHY I'M SAYING, TO YOUR POINT, YES, YOU ARE CORRECT, THAT IF ANY GOOD DEVELOPER WOULD HAVE LOOKED AT IT, BE LIKE, HEY, THIS IS A RT DISTRICT, THESE ARE THE USERS THAT YOU CAN HAVE.

>> YOU ARE NOT THE ORIGINAL OWNER 10 YEARS AGO?

>> NO, WE ARE, BUT IT'S A FAMILY OWNED BUSINESS.

MY FATHER WAS THE ONE WHO PURCHASED.

>> YOU THREW DADDY UNDER THE BUS.

[LAUGHTER]

>> NOW WE'RE AT A POINT WHERE IT'S LIKE, WELL, WHAT DO WE DO? IT'S LIKE, WE SPENT THIS MONEY, WE'VE TRIED TO DEVELOP IT, WE'RE TRYING OUR BEST, AND WE BUILT BEAUTIFUL BUILDINGS.

IT'S NOT A RECTANGULAR BOX.

THERE'S SOME DESIGN ELEMENTS.

LOTS OF TIME AND ENERGY HAS BEEN SPENT INTO THESE BUILDINGS.

>> SECOND QUESTION. THE TWO SMALLER OR THREE SMALLER BUILDINGS, WHEN WERE THOSE BUILT?

>> ALL THOSE ARE 2021.

>> 2021.

>> YES, SIR. DURING COVID.

>>YES. IF YOU LOOK AT THE ZONING, IT SEEMS VERY BROAD IN THE RT DISTRICT.

IF YOU LOOK AT IT, IT HAS A LOT OF DIFFERENT USERS INSIDE.

WE FELT LIKE WE WERE ABLE TO LEASE WITH THAT IN MIND BECAUSE YOU'RE ABLE TO HAVE BANK, HEALTH FACILITIES, AND EVEN SEEMS A LOT OF SIMILAR TO RETAIL, BUT ALSO HAVING SOME OFFICE AND SOME FLEX.

YOU GET A NICE MIX OF DIFFERENT ZONING IN THERE.

THAT'S WHAT WE CAME TO SEE THAT, HEY, WE'RE ABLE TO LEASE HERE.

BUT AFTER TRYING TO LEASE, AND WE'VE BEEN LEASING FOR REALLY OVER THREE YEARS NOW, THE FACT THAT WE'RE NOT EVEN CLOSE TO THIS 92% OCCUPANCY WHERE WE HAVE SIGNS AND WE ARE ON TOP OF EVERY COSTAR AND LOOPNET IS SOMETHING TO BE SAID HERE.

THERE IS SOMETHING GOING ON HERE THAT IS NOT CORRECT.

>> BECAUSE THE ZONING WAS NOT INTENDED FOR RETAIL.

>> CORRECT. BUT EVEN NO RT USERS ARE COMING TO ME AND SAYING, HEY, YOU KNOW WHAT, I WANT 12,000 SQUARE FEET.

EVEN WHEN I HAVE IT ON COSTAR, I HAVE UP TO 25,000 SQUARE FEET.

YOU WOULD THINK THAT PEOPLE WOULD AT LEAST CALL ME BECAUSE I HAD A BUILDING, WAS SUPPOSED TO BE 25,000 SQUARE FEET.

I'D HAVE AT LEAST PEOPLE REACHING OUT, WANTING TO DO SOMETHING WITH THAT 25,000, AND HAVE NOT HAD ANY TRACTION OTHER THAN THE ANCILLARY SERVICES, LIKE YOUR HEALTH FITNESS, YOUR MEDICAL USERS.

I'M SLOWLY GETTING THOSE, BUT I'M NOT GETTING YOUR SHUTTERFLY, OR YOUR AIRBUS THAT'S DOWN THE STREET, OR ALL THOSE TENANTS, YOUR QT.

THOSE COMPANIES HAVE MOVED HERE AND THAT'S WHERE THEY WANT TO BE.

[01:45:03]

THE REMAINING SPOTS ARE NOT GETTING LEASED. YOU CAN SEE THAT.

>> I UNDERSTAND, TRUST ME.

I'VE RUN A SMALL BUSINESS BEFORE.

I FEEL YOUR PAIN.

BUT I WANT TO UNDERSTAND IF YOU KNOW THAT WHAT WE NEED TO SOLVE FOR IS THE CITY'S NEEDS.

>> YES, SIR.

>> NOT NECESSARILY A PARTICULAR BUSINESS NEEDS.

>> YES, SIR. COMPLETELY UNDERSTOOD.

>> COMMISSIONERS, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? NOBODY? I'M SORRY. COMMISSIONER LINGENFELTER.

>> I THINK EVERYBODY'S TOUCHED ON A LOT OF STUFF I WAS ALREADY THINKING OF, BUT YOU'VE HINTED ON SOME THINGS TOO.

SOMETHING THAT WE HAVE TO CONSIDER AS WELL WHEN WE MAKE DECISIONS AND WE DEVIATE FROM MAYBE RECOMMENDATIONS OR EVEN FROM THE CONCEPT PLAN BECAUSE WE DO HAVE TO BASICALLY SIGN OUR LIVES AWAY IF WE DO THAT, WE HAVE TO ALSO UNDERSTAND PRECEDENCE.

ARE WE SETTING A PRECEDENCE, NOT JUST FOR YOU, BUT OTHERS IN THE DISTRICT AND OTHER OWNERSHIPS AND STUFF? WE GOT TO CONSIDER, ARE WE SETTING A PRECEDENCE IF WE DEVIATE? THAT'S SOMETHING WE REALLY HAVE TO CONSIDER HERE, AND I JUST WANT YOU TO BE AWARE OF THAT.

I DON'T SEE A WAY AROUND THAT VERY EASILY.

>> YES, SIR. I DO REALLY APPRECIATE THAT.

I KNOW I'M COMING HERE ASKING A LOT AND I KNOW RT DISTRICT IS THE BABY OF THE CITY OF PLANO.

TRUST ME, I'VE HEARD IT, I KNOW IT, AND I SUPPORT IT.

I WANT THE BUSINESSES TO GROW IN THERE AND I WANT IT TO BE BETTER, BUT THIS IS A UNIQUE CASE.

IT'S NOT LIKE, AGAIN, THOSE BIG BUILDINGS WHERE IT'S HARD TO POTENTIALLY COME IN AND DO ANOTHER ZONING CHANGE ON A BUILDING THAT'S 85, 100,000 SQUARE FEET.

THESE ARE THE ONLY BUILDINGS IN THE RT DISTRICT THAT ARE THIS SIZE.

MAYBE THIS IS ANOTHER WAY THAT IS A CERTAIN SITUATION AND SCENARIO THAT COULD HELP BENEFIT THIS, BUT I UNDERSTAND.

>> COMMISSIONERS, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> I THINK THE ONLY PERSON THAT WAS REGISTERED THAT DIDN'T SPEAK WAS LAURA GUNN.

NOT GOING TO SPEAK. DO WE HAVE ANYBODY ELSE REGISTERED TO SPEAK ON THIS ITEM?

>> THERE ARE NONE.

>> I'LL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING.

RESERVE THE COMMENTS TO THE COMMISSION.

I'M GOING TO LEAD OFF A LITTLE BIT ON THIS ONE JUST BECAUSE I UNDERSTAND THE APPLICANT'S CHALLENGE. I FEEL YOUR PAIN.

THE ISSUE I HAVE IS I THINK THE USE IS INTERESTING AND I THINK IT PROBABLY IS SOMETHING THAT'S NEEDED IN THE COMMUNITY, BUT INDOOR AMUSEMENT IS ALLOWED IN 10 OF OUR 14 COMMERCIAL ZONING DISTRICTS BY RIGHT.

IT'S ALLOWED IN TWO OTHER ONES BY SPECIAL USE PERMIT.

IT'S ONLY PROHIBITED IN TWO, WHICH IS THIS RT DISTRICT AND NEIGHBORHOOD OFFICE.

I WOULD HOPE THAT THE USERS, THE INDOOR PLAYGROUND WOULD LOOK AT ONE OF THE USES WHERE THEY'RE ALLOWED BY RIGHT BECAUSE IT'S INTENDED TO BE IN THOSE DISTRICTS, WHERE IT'S CLOSER TO HOMES AND INTENDED TO BE A 24-HOUR, SEVEN DAY A WEEK OPERATION.

I AM VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THE EROSION OF THE RT DISTRICT BY ALLOWING OTHER USES IN THERE THAT AREN'T SUPPORTIVE OF THE EMPLOYMENT.

I THINK THE INTENT WAS TO HAVE AN EMPLOYMENT BASE WITH SUPPORT SERVICES THAT ARE FOR THE EMPLOYMENT BASE.

I CANNOT RATIONALIZE, NO MATTER MY GYMNASTICS I GO THROUGH, AN INDOOR PLAYGROUND FOR TODDLERS BEING SUPPORTIVE OF EMPLOYMENT BASE.

IT JUST DOESN'T FIT TO ME.

DAYCARE FITS TO ME, MEDICAL FITS TO ME, FITNESS FITS TO ME.

I COULD EVEN MAKE AN ARGUMENT I WANT TO GO PLAY PICKLE BALL AT LUNCH.

BUT AN INDOOR TODDLER PLAYGROUND, I CAN'T MAKE THAT LEAP.

THAT'S WHERE I AM. I'LL OPEN IT UP TO THE COMMISSION. COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF.

>> THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. THE RHETORICAL QUESTION I FRAMED BEFORE, WHICH WAS PRESERVING THE INTEGRITY OF THE INTENT OF THE RT DISTRICT VERSUS A NON-PERFORMING PROPERTY WAS NOT INTENDED TO SUGGEST A SOLUTION.

IT WAS SIMPLY INTENDED TO FRAME THE ISSUE.

IN RESOLVING THE ISSUE, I THINK I HAVE TO ASK, WHO SHOULD BEAR THE RISK OF A NON-PERFORMING PROPERTY? THE APPLICANT OR THE CITY?

[01:50:02]

IN THIS CASE, IT WAS THE APPLICANT WHO, WITH KNOWLEDGE OF THE RT DISTRICT, WITH THE UNDERLYING PURPOSE OF THE RT DISTRICT TO ANCHOR THE DISTRICT AS A SOURCE OF EMPLOYMENT FOR A PARTICULAR TYPE OF THE INDUSTRY, CHOSE TO COME FORWARD AND ASK FOR PERMISSION TO BUILD THESE BUILDINGS.

HE WAS GRANTED THAT PERMISSION, BUT WAS PLACED ON NOTICE.

THIS IS THE ZONING THAT YOU HAVE.

AS LONG AS YOU UNDERSTAND THAT, YOU CAN BUILD YOUR BUILDINGS.

IT WAS THE APPLICANT WHO DECIDED UPON THE DESIGN AND THE SIZE OF THE BUILDING, WHICH APPARENTLY HAVE PROVED TO BE UNSUITABLE FOR THE TYPE OF USE WHICH IS THE BASIS OF THE RT ZONING.

IF THE RISK OF THE NON-PERFORMING PROPERTY IS PLACED UPON THE APPLICANT, THE APPLICANT HAS RISKED A SIGNIFICANT INVESTMENT.

IF THE RISK OF THE NON-PERFORMING PROPERTY IS PLACED ON THE CITY, THEN THE CITY HAS SUFFERED, AS YOU PUT IT, MR. CHAIRMAN, AN EROSION OF ONE OF THE MAJOR ECONOMIC GENERATORS OF THE CITY, NAMELY THE RESEARCH AND TECHNOLOGY DISTRICT.

I THINK IT IS ONLY FAIR THAT THE CONSEQUENCES OF DECISIONS WHICH HAVE PROVED NOT TO BE SUCCESSFUL SHOULD BE PLACED UPON THE PEOPLE THAT MADE THOSE DECISIONS, AND IN THIS CASE, THAT IS THE APPLICANT.

I'M NOT UNSENSITIVE TO THE QUANDARY HE FINDS HIMSELF IN.

I HOPE HE CAN FIND A WAY TO MAKE THIS PROPERTY WORK WITHIN THE RT CONCEPT, BUT IF HE CAN'T, IT WAS THE OWNER'S DECISIONS THAT GOT HIM IN THIS SITUATION IN THE FIRST PLACE.

I'M SORRY TO SAY. I BELIEVE THE CITY HAS TOO MUCH TO LOSE TO APPROVE AN EROSION OF THE RT DISTRICT.

FOR THAT REASON, I MUST RELUCTANTLY OPPOSE THIS REQUEST. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. MR. BENDER.

>> THANK YOU, CHAIRMAN. I WOULD ECHO YOUR COMMENTS, COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF, IN A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT ANGLE.

THE EDC PART OF THE CITY WORKING ON ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT HAS HAD A LOT OF COMPANIES THAT RELOCATED HERE RECENTLY THAT ARE TECHNOLOGY RELATED TYPE FIRMS THAT WANT TO GROW AND ALSO WANT TO MANUFACTURE HERE IN PLANO.

I MET WITH A FIRM TODAY THAT'S A ROBOTICS FIRM RELOCATED FROM CALIFORNIA, AND THEY'RE GOING TO BE EXPANDING.

THERE'S GOT TO BE A PLACE FOR COMPANIES LIKE THAT.

WHAT WE SEE OVER THE COURSE OF TIME ARE PEAKS AND VALLEYS IN DEMAND.

I THINK THAT'S WHY WE HAVE TO BE DILIGENT IN MAINTAINING THE INTEGRITY OF THE INTENDED USE BECAUSE WE'RE GOING THROUGH ONE OF THOSE TIMES OF EXPANSION.

WE'RE HAVING COMPANIES THAT COME HERE THAT WOULD FIT THIS NEED THAT ARE WANTING TO GROW.

I THINK THAT'S WHY WE NEED TO PRESERVE THE INTENDED USE BECAUSE WE GO THROUGH THESE PERIODS OF ECONOMIC TIMES. THOSE ARE MY THOUGHTS.

>> MR. BRONSKY.

>> THAT'S OKAY. I'LL GO.

MR. KIM, I'M SORRY. CAN I ASK YOU A QUESTION?

>> SORRY ABOUT THAT. A COUPLE OF MEETINGS BACK.

WE LOOKED AT A MAP OF THE RT DISTRICT.

WE NOTICED THAT THERE WERE PLACES WHERE THE RT DISTRICT HAD BEEN GOBBLED UP AND SHRUNK.

SHOULD WE APPROVE THIS, THIS WOULD BE A FURTHER EROSION INTO THAT MAP, AM I CORRECT?

>> OKAY. THANK YOU. THAT WAS MY QUESTION FOR YOU.

I JUST WANTED TO SO I'VE GOT TO SAY WITH FULL DISCLOSURE, MY FOUR GRANDCHILDREN WOULD ABSOLUTELY LOVE TO VISIT THIS PLAYGROUND THAT YOU'RE DESCRIBING, AND I THINK IT WOULD BE A GREAT EXPERIENCE FOR THEM.

BUT AS WE'VE TALKED ABOUT UP HERE, THIS ISN'T SOMETHING PERSONAL, AND THIS ISN'T SOMETHING AGAINST WANTING YOU TO MAKE PROFIT, WANTING YOU TO BE SUCCESSFUL IN THE AREA, IT'S NOT EVEN NOT WANTING TO BE ONE OF THE LEADING EDGES OF THIS ENTERTAINMENT FOR PEOPLE OF THIS AGE.

COMMISSIONER BENDER HIT IT RIGHT ON THE NAIL ON THE HEAD.

THIS IS ABOUT PRESERVING THE INTENDED USE.

IF WE OPEN UP THE USES FOR THIS THAT IS NOT DESIGNED TO SUPPORT THE RT DISTRICT ITSELF.

[01:55:08]

IT'S ACTUALLY THE APPLICANT MADE IT CLEAR THAT THIS WAS DESIGNED TO SUPPORT THE ANCILLARY USE OF THE DISTRICT, WHICH I THINK WE START GETTING SO FAR REMOVED FROM THE INTENTION OF THE RT DISTRICT, THAT IT MAKES IT UNTENABLE FOR US AS A COMMISSION TO APPROPRIATELY MAINTAIN THE INTEGRITY OF THE DISTRICT ITSELF.

SO I'VE GOT TO AGREE WITH THE PREVIOUS COMMISSIONERS THAT I JUST CAN'T SEE GOBBLING MORE INTO THIS DISTRICT, AND I'M NOT GOING TO SIT AND REGRET ANOTHER VOTE IN SAYING THAT WE PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE WAITED, AND I THINK COMMISSIONER BENDER'S POINT OF THE PEAKS AND VALLEYS OF THE RT USAGES.

WE MAY BE AT A VALLEY OF THAT RIGHT AT THE MOMENT.

BUT THIS WAS INTENDED FOR AN RT DISTRICT.

WE MADE IT CLEAR WHEN THE APPLICANT PURCHASED IT, AND THEY'VE EVEN ACKNOWLEDGED THAT IT WAS PURCHASED WITH NOT A FULL UNDERSTANDING.

THE CITY SHOULDN'T BEAR THAT, SO THEY, MR. KIM?

>> LET'S KEEP YEAH, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S A FAIR QUESTION FOR STAFF.

LET'S KEEP THAT AMONGST OURSELVES.

>> I WOULD ARGUE THE CITY SHOULDN'T BEAR THAT, AS COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF SAID.

AGAIN, THE LACK OF CONFORMANCE, THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN TO ME IS ALSO ANOTHER ISSUE THAT LUMPS ON TOP OF THAT. SO THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. NOW, COMMISSIONER OLLEY, APOLOGIZE.

I'LL KEEP IT SHORT.

WE'RE SOLVING FOR THE DISTRICT, NOT THE SITE.

IS THE RT DISTRICT STILL RETURNING ON THE INVESTMENT THE CITY HAS MADE TO THE DISTRICT? THAT'S A WORK STREAM FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT OR PLANNING DEPARTMENT TO FIGURE OUT IF WE NEED TO LOOK AT THE DISTRICT AND REJIG WHAT WE INTEND THAT DISTRICT TO DO.

WHEN WE MAKE CAPITAL-INTENSIVE OUTLAYS AROUND THE DISTRICT, IT'S WITH LOOKING AT IT FROM A LONG-TERM PLAN 02050 PERSPECTIVE.

IF WE HAVE TO CHANGE OUR USES FOR A DISTRICT EVERY THREE TO FIVE YEARS DUE TO MACROECONOMIC CONDITIONS, NOBODY'S GOING TO MOVE HERE BECAUSE THERE WILL BE TOO MUCH UNCERTAINTY.

BECAUSE NOBODY CAN TELL WHAT RULES THEY'RE GOING TO PLAY WITH EVERY TWO TO THREE YEARS.

I THINK I'M IN SUPPORT OF WHAT EVERYONE IS SAYING, AND WE'LL BE OPPOSING THIS.

UNFORTUNATELY, BECAUSE AGAIN, THIS DOES NOT SOLVE A PAIN POINT FOR A DISTRICT AND THE CITY.

>> THANK YOU, COMMISSION LINGENFELTER.

>> NOT TO REPEAT WHAT EVERYBODY ELSE HAS BEEN SAYING.

JUST TO ADD TO IT.

THIS IS MORE DIRECTED TO THE APPLICANT.

WE DO CARE. WE DO WANT YOU TO SUCCEED.

WE HAVE TO ADHERE TO WHAT IS SET BY THE CITY ZONING WISE, CONCEPTUAL PLANS-WISE.

YOU HAD TALKED ABOUT LOOPNET AND ALL THESE THINGS.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'VE REACHED OUT TO THE EDC.

DOUG, COMMISSIONER BENDER HAD ALLUDED TO THEM.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'VE TALKED TO DOUG MCDONALD, BUT HE'S GREAT, AND HE AND HIS STAFF IS GREAT WITH THE EDC.

IF YOU HAVEN'T, I'M SURE MANY OF US HAVE DEALT WITH HIM AND CAN MAKE AN INTRODUCTION TO HELP YOU OUT.

BUT HE AND HIS TEAM HAS BEEN GREAT AT BRINGING COMPANIES TO THE CITY, WHICH HE HAD ALLUDED TO.

>> COMMISSIONER BRONSKY.

>> WELL, I'M SORRY, BUT I MOVE THAT WE FOLLOW THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE STAFF AND THAT WE DENY THIS CASE.

>> COMMISSIONER OLLEY, SECOND.

COMMISSION BENNER, DID YOU WISH TO MAKE A COMMENT BEFORE THE VOTE? A YES VOTE WILL BE TO DENY THE REQUEST.

WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND TO DENY THE REQUEST.

SO AS WE SAID, A YES VOTE WOULD BE TO DENY THE REQUEST.

[02:00:12]

>> EVERYBODY VOTED. MOTION PASSES SEVEN TO ZERO TO DENY THE REQUESTED ZONING CHANGE.

ALL RIGHT. NON-PUBLIC HEARING ITEMS. ITEMS FOR INDIVIDUAL CONSIDERATION.

NON-PUBLIC HEARING ITEMS.

>> LET ME STOP YOU IN A SECOND.

COMMISSION FIVE MINUTE BREAK BEFORE WE GET INTO OUR FAIRLY LENGTHY PRESENTATIONS HERE.

I PRESUME. ALL RIGHT.

LET'S TAKE FIVE MINUTES AND WE'LL RECONVENE AT WHAT IS IT'S 805.

OKAY. ITEM 4.

[4. (MC) Discussion and Action – Call for Public Hearing: Request to call a public hearing to amend and expand Urban Mixed Use-1 on 156.3 acres located at the southeast corner of Plano Parkway and Custer Road. Project #CPH2025-002. Applicant: Jackson, Walker, LLP. (Legislative consideration) ]

>> ITEMS FOR INDIVIDUAL CONSIDERATION, NON PUBLIC HEARING ITEMS. THE PRESIDING OFFICER WILL PERMIT LIMITED PUBLIC COMMENT FOR ITEMS ON THE AGENDA NOT POSTED FOR A PUBLIC HEARING.

THE PRESIDING OFFICER WILL ESTABLISH TIME LIMITS BASED UPON THE NUMBER OF SPEAKER REQUESTS, LENGTH OF THE AGENDA, AND TO ENSURE MEETING EFFICIENCY, AND MAY INCLUDE A TOTAL TIME LIMIT.

AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 4, DISCUSSION AND ACTION.

REQUESTS TO CALL A PUBLIC HEARING TO AMEND AND EXPAND URBAN MIXED-USE ONE ON 156.3 ACRES LOCATED AT THE SOUTHEAST CORNER OF PLANO PARKWAY AND CUSTER ROAD.

THE APPLICANT IS JACKSON WALKER LOP.

THIS ITEM IS FOR LEGISLATIVE CONSIDERATION.

>> GOOD EVENING.

ON FEBRUARY 2025, THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION CALLED A PUBLIC HEARING TO AMEND THE URBAN MIXED-USE ONE DISTRICT TO MAKE MODIFICATIONS TO THE WESTERN PORTION OF THE DISTRICT.

SINCE THAT TIME, THE APPLICANT HAS COME BACK REQUESTING TO ADD SOME ADDITIONAL WORK INTO THE SCOPE, INCLUDING TO EXPAND THE UMU DISTRICT TO INCLUDE A PORTION OF THE LI ONE ZONING DISTRICT THERE IN THE MIDDLE.

THE CALL FOR PUBLIC HEARING IS NECESSARY FOR THE PURPOSE OF TRANSPARENCY FOR THE PUBLIC AND AFFECTED PROPERTY OWNERS.

STAFF RECOMMENDS THAT THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION CALL A PUBLIC HEARING FOR THIS PURPOSE.

HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.

>> ALL RIGHT. QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? MR. BROUNOFF.

LET ME JUST LOOKING AT YOUR MAP, IT LOOKS LIKE THE LITTLE AREA IN THE CUTOUT AREA IN THE MIDDLE LABELED LI ONE IS EXCLUDED FROM THIS CASE, IS THAT CORRECT?

>> YES. WITH THE ZONING CASE THAT WILL BE COMING FORWARD, THEY WILL BE REQUESTING TO AMEND AND EXPAND THE UMU DISTRICT TO INCLUDE A PORTION OF THE LI ONE ZONING.

>> THEN THEN THERE'S THE EASTERN PORTION, WHICH IS TO THE EAST OF THE LI ONE DISTRICT, IS THAT NEW?

>> THAT WILL BE INCLUDED IN THE ZONING CASE, ALTHOUGH I DON'T BELIEVE THERE WILL BE ANY CHANGES TO THE EASTERN PORTION OF THE DISTRICT.

>> THE LI ONE DISTRICT IS GOING TO BE FILLED IN, IN OTHER WORDS, A PORTION OF IT, YES.

>> PORTION OF IT. ALL RIGHT.

THANK YOU. COMMISSION. NOW THE QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? COMMISSIONER OLLEY.

>> I DON'T KNOW.

I ASSUMED ALL OF THE LI 1 WAS GOING TO BE FILLED IN.

WHY JUST THE PORTION?

>> THERE'S AN EXISTING BUILDING THAT ZONED LI 1 THAT YOU COULD SEE.

THE AREA TO THE EAST THAT'S UNDEVELOPED WILL BE INCORPORATED INTO THE UMU DISTRICT.

THE EXISTING BUILDING WILL REMAIN LI 1.

>> OKAY. ALL RIGHT.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OF STAFF? NOBODY? I BELIEVE IF I'VE SEARCHED THE CROWD THAT THE APPLICANT MIGHT BE OUT THERE SOMEWHERE AND HAS BEEN WAITING FOR TWO HOURS.

BILL, IF YOU FEEL LIKE YOU NEED TO PAY OFF YOUR WEIGHT AND SPEAK, WE'D CERTAINLY BE HAPPY TO HEAR FROM YOU, BUT.

NO NEED? COMMISSION? MISS BRONSKI.

>> I GUESS WE GET BILL OUT OF HERE AND LET HIM RUN IN THE HILL.

I MOVE THAT WE FOLLOW THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE STAFF AND CALL A PUBLIC HEARING FOR AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 4 AS STAFF HAS DEFINED IT.

>> COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF.

>> I SECOND THE MOTION.

ABOUT RUNNING IN THE HILL OR ABOUT THE.

I'LL LEAVE THE RUNNING IN THE HILL UP TO THE APPLICANT.

>> COMMISSIONER, WE HAVE A MOTION IN A SECOND.

PLEASE VOTE. MOTION PASSES SEVEN TO ZERO.

YOU'RE WELCOME TO HANG OUT WITH US AS LONG AS YOU LIKE.

>> AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 5.

[5. (NC) Discussion – 2025 Planning Department Annual Report: Receive a presentation on the 2025 Planning Department Annual Report. Project #DI2025-001. Applicant: City of Plano. (For information only)]

[02:05:01]

DISCUSSION. RECEIVE A PRESENTATION ON THE 2025 PLANNING DEPARTMENT ANNUAL REPORT.

THE APPLICANT IS THE CITY OF PLANO.

THIS ITEM IS FOR INFORMATION ONLY.

>> GOOD EVENING. MY NAME IS NICK COLEMAN, LEAD PLANNER WITH THE CITY OF PLANO, AND I'LL BE PRESENTING THE 2025 PLANNING DEPARTMENT ANNUAL REPORT.

IT WILL INCLUDE A BRIEF DEPARTMENT OVERVIEW AND THEN PLANNING DEPARTMENT ACTIVITIES FROM 2024, COVERING ZONING AND DEVELOPMENT, COMPREHENSIVE PLANNING, AND SCHOOL DEMOGRAPHIC AND HOUSING DATA.

SO HERE'S OUR CURRENT ORGANIZATIONAL CHART.

IT'S COLOR-CODED TO SHOW THE FOUR DIVISIONS WITHIN THE DEPARTMENT.

THE FIRST DIVISION AND THE ONE WITH WHICH YOU'LL BE MOST FAMILIAR IS DEVELOPMENT REVIEW, WHICH HANDLES ZONING AND SITE PLANS, PLATS, ANY TYPE OF PLAN RELATED TO LAND USE OR LAND DEVELOPMENT.

COMPREHENSIVE PLANNING, WHICH IS BROKEN OUT INTO TWO WORK GROUPS, HERITAGE AND INFORMATION, WHICH ADMINISTERS THE HERITAGE PRESERVATION PROGRAM.

THEN ALSO CONDUCTS DEMOGRAPHIC AND DEVELOPMENT ANALYSIS, AND THEN LONG-RANGE PLANNING, WHICH MAINTAINS THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND CONDUCTS SMALL AREA PLANS AND OTHER SPECIAL STUDIES AS WELL AS MOBILITY PLANNING.

LAND RECORDS PLANNING WHICH IS ALSO SPLIT INTO TWO GROUPS.

LAND RECORDS MAINTAINS THE CITY'S GIS DATA, WHICH IS USED BY MULTIPLE DEPARTMENTS, AND DEVELOPMENT SERVICES MAINTAINS THE CITY'S ZONING ORDINANCE AND ALSO HANDLES RESEARCHING OF EMERGING TOPICS IN PLANNING, AND ALSO REVIEWS CERTIFICATES OF OCCUPANCY AND WORDS WITH PROPERTY STANDARDS.

BUSINESS SERVICES IS THE CONNECTIVE TISSUE THAT CONNECTS ALL OF THE OTHER DIVISIONS TRANSMITS INFORMATION BETWEEN THEM.

IT'S ALSO THE PUBLIC FACE OF THE DEPARTMENT HANDLING CUSTOMER SERVICE HANDLING THOUSANDS OF WALK-INS AND TELEPHONE CALLS.

THEY'RE ALSO HANDLING BUDGETING AND TRAINING, AND TECHNOLOGY FOR THE DEPARTMENT.

PLANNING SUPPORTS THREE BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS, PLANNING AND ZONING, OF COURSE, BUT ALSO HERITAGE COMMISSION, WHICH REVIEWS HERITAGE-RELATED ACTIVITIES IN OUR HERITAGE SITES AND DISTRICTS, AND BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS, WHICH WE SUPPORT PRIMARILY FOR ZONING VARIANCES.

FOR ZONING AND DEVELOPMENT, TO START WITH, WE'LL LOOK AT SUBMITTALS.

LAST YEAR, WE HAD 688 PROJECT SUBMITTALS, A SLIGHT DECREASE FROM LAST YEAR, BUT IF YOU LOOK OVER THE PAST FEW YEARS, IT'S RELATIVELY CONSISTENT AROUND 700 PLANS OR PROJECT SUBMITTALS EVERY YEAR.

OUR REPORT HAS A ZONING PETITION LOCATION MAP, SO YOU CAN SEE THE LOCATION AND TYPE OF EVERY ZONING CASE THAT WE HANDLED OVER THE COURSE OF THE LAST YEAR, AND YOU CAN SEE THE TOTAL ACRES REZONED WAS 550.

THE AVERAGE TIME TO DECISION WAS 113 DAYS.

OVER THE PAST FEW DAYS, THERE HAS BEEN NOT DAYS, YEARS.

THERE'S BEEN AN INCREASE IN THE AVERAGE TIME TO DECISION.

THERE'S BEEN AN INCREASE PRIMARILY AS A RESULT OF THE COMPLEXITY OF CERTAIN CASES THAT TAKE LONGER TO WORK THROUGH THE DEVELOPMENT PROCESS.

A BIG CHALLENGE TO DEVELOPMENT IS THE DECREASE IN GREENFIELD-READY SITES IN THE CITY AS OUR UNDEVELOPED LAND DECREASES.

AS OF JANUARY 1 OF THIS YEAR, WE HAVE 1863 ACRES OF UNDEVELOPED LAND LEFT, WHICH IS ONLY 4% OF THE TOTAL LAND AREA IN THE CITY.

THAT UNDEVELOPED LAND IS ZONED LESS THAN 11% RESIDENTIAL.

IT'S 12% AGRICULTURAL, AND OVER 77% OF IT IS ZONED FOR NON-RESIDENTIAL USES.

LOOKING AT THE ZONING OF UNDEVELOPED LAND.

ONE THING WE ADDED TO THE REPORT LAST YEAR IS A ZONING ANALYSIS.

IN THE REPORT, WE HAVE A DATA TABLE THAT ACCOMPANIES THIS MAP WHERE YOU CAN SEE THE ACREAGE OF UNDEVELOPED LAND WITHIN EACH BASE ZONING DISTRICT, AND THEN ALSO WITHIN EACH ZONING DISTRICT, HOW MUCH UNDEVELOPED LAND WAS DEVELOPED WITHIN THE PAST YEAR, HOW MUCH LAND WAS ZONED, HOW MANY PLANS WERE APPROVED.

THIS IS OUR MAJOR PROJECT MAP FOR THE 2025 REPORT.

IT SHOWS THE LOCATION OF ALL MAJOR PROJECTS.

[02:10:01]

MOSTLY, THESE ARE MIXED-USE DEVELOPMENTS, AND THE REPORT HAS INFORMATION ON THE STATUS OF EACH OF THESE PROJECTS.

FOR THE ZONING ORDINANCE, TURNING AWAY FROM DEVELOPMENT.

LAST YEAR, THE ZONING AND SUBDIVISION ORDINANCE REWRITE PROJECT KICKED OFF.

IS A MULTI-YEAR PROJECT THAT WILL EXTEND THROUGH 2026, AND IT'LL BE A FULL REWRITE OF THE ZONING AND SUBDIVISION CODES, INTENDED TO MAKE THEM MORE STREAMLINED AND EFFICIENT.

LAST YEAR, SHORT-TERM RENTAL REGULATIONS WERE INCORPORATED INTO THE ZONING ORDINANCE, WHICH INCLUDED A REGISTRATION PROGRAM.

DRONE DELIVERY WAS INCORPORATED INTO THE ORDINANCE, AND PARKING RELIEF WAS ALSO INCORPORATED.

TURNING TO COMPREHENSIVE PLANNING.

SINCE THE APPROVAL OF THE CP PLAN IN 2021, WE'VE HAD AN ANNUAL PLAN MAINTENANCE PROCESS IN THE 2024 CYCLE.

WE UPDATED ACTIONS RELATED TO THE ECONOMIC ENVIRONMENT AND REGIONALISM PILLARS OF THE PLAN, AND SOME MAPPED UPDATES, WHICH YOU'LL HEAR MORE ABOUT IN THE NEXT PRESENTATION, SPECIFICALLY RELATED TO THE ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH EXPRESSWAY CORRIDOR MAP.

>> FOR LONG RANGE AND MOBILITY PLANNING, A LARGE ACCOMPLISHMENT OVER THE PAST YEAR THAT BLED INTO 2025 WAS THE SILVER LINE STATION AREA PLAN FOR THE SILVER LINE STATIONS THAT ARE GOING IN AT 12TH STREET AND SHILOH ROAD.

WE'RE MOVING INTO THE IMPLEMENTATION PHASE FOR THAT PLAN IN 2025, AND THE COMMUNITY DESIGN PLAN, WHICH IS AN ONGOING PROJECT LEADING INTO THIS YEAR AS WELL.

FOR HERITAGE PRESERVATION, LAST YEAR, IN JUNE, THE 2024 UPDATE TO THE HERITAGE PRESERVATION PLAN WAS APPROVED.

IT INCLUDED A HERITAGE RESOURCE SURVEY OF PROPERTIES AND NEIGHBORHOODS BUILT BETWEEN 1970-1975, WHICH ARE CROSSING THAT 50 YEAR THRESHOLD AT WHICH THEY'RE CONSIDERED HISTORIC, AND OFFERED PRESERVATION ADVICE FOR THOSE LOCATIONS.

THESE ARE OUR HERITAGE PRESERVATION GRANT RECIPIENTS.

THERE HAD BEEN FOR SEVERAL YEARS, ONLY THREE OF THEM, BUT WE ADDED THE PLANO AFRICAN AMERICAN MUSEUM AND MASONIC LODGE IN RECENT YEARS.

LAST YEAR, THERE WERE OVER 70,000 VISITORS TO OUR HERITAGE GRANT RECIPIENTS, THE HERITAGE TAX EXEMPTION PROGRAM, WHICH HELPS HISTORIC HOMEOWNERS AND BUSINESS OWNERS OFFSET THE COST OF OWNING HISTORIC BUILDINGS, AIDED 86 PROPERTY OWNERS LAST YEAR.

LOOKING AT DEMOGRAPHICS, ONE THING THAT WE REPORT ON EVERY YEAR IS SCHOOL DATA.

THE BIG TREND THAT'S BEEN ONGOING IN PLANO IS THE DECREASE IN THE SCHOOL AGE POPULATION, PARTICULARLY THE UNDER 10 POPULATION.

THE MOST SALIENT RESULT FOR SCHOOLS IS THE DECREASE, LIKE A WIDENING GAP BETWEEN SENIORS GRADUATING OUT OF HIGH SCHOOL IN PLANO ISD AND KINDERGARTNERS ENTERING, AS YOU CAN SEE IN THE GRAPH ON THE LOWER RIGHT.

ANOTHER THING WE REPORT, WHICH WE SHARE WITH SCHOOL DISTRICTS AT OUR ANNUAL EDUCATION MEETING, WHICH WE HAD, I THINK A WEEK AND A HALF AGO, IS HOUSING PERMITTING ACTIVITY WITHIN SCHOOL DISTRICTS, WHICH WE PROVIDE TO TRY TO GIVE THEM A SENSE OF HOW MANY HOUSING UNITS ARE GOING IN AND THEREBY, HOW MANY CHILDREN THEY CAN EXPECT WILL BE GENERATED IN THOSE HOUSING UNITS.

LOOKING AT HOUSING UNITS MORE GENERALLY, LAST YEAR, WE HAD JUST SHY OF 1,400 UNITS THAT HAD BUILDING PERMITS ISSUED.

WE TRACK HOUSING PERMITS OVER TIME, AS YOU CAN SEE IN THE GRAPH ON THE BOTTOM OF THE SLIDE, AND WE HAVE OVER 11,000 HOUSING PERMITS PENDING.

FOR THE LOCATION OF WHERE THOSE PENDING HOUSING UNITS ARE, WE HAVE AN ACTIVE RESIDENTIAL AREAS MAP IN THE REPORT, AND WE HAVE A TWO PAGE SPREAD WITH TABLES THAT HAVE HOUSING UNITS AND STATUS OF HOW MANY ARE APPROVED AND HOW MANY ARE REMAINING.

AS WE TRACK UNITS, WE'RE ABLE TO SAY AT ANY GIVEN TIME, HOW MANY WE HAVE IN THE CITY, AS OF JANUARY 1ST, WE HAD 121,480 HOUSING UNITS.

[02:15:02]

THE BALANCE BETWEEN SINGLE FAMILY AND MULTI FAMILY WAS 62% SINGLE FAMILY, 38% MULTIFAMILY.

WITH THE 11,188 PENDING UNITS AND MORE UNITS THAT WE EXPECT OVER THE NEXT 20 YEARS, WE EXPECT THE PERCENTAGE WILL SHIFT SLIGHTLY TO 60% SINGLE FAMILY, 40% MULTIFAMILY.

IN TRACKING THE PERMIT DATA AS WE DO, WE'RE ABLE TO ALSO USE IT TO MAKE POPULATION ESTIMATES AND PROJECTIONS, INCORPORATING DEMOGRAPHIC DATA FROM THE AMERICAN COMMUNITY SURVEY.

OUR JANUARY 1ST POPULATION ESTIMATE FOR PLANO IS 298,430 RESIDENTS.

USING THE PENDING UNITS FROM THE TABLE, BARRING OTHER DEMOGRAPHIC TRENDS THAT ARE BEYOND RECKONING, WE ANTICIPATE THAT OVER THE NEXT 10, 15 YEARS, WE WILL INCREASE OUR POPULATION FROM THOSE HOUSING UNITS TO 316,200 APPROXIMATELY.

THAT CONCLUDES MY PRESENTATION.

I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE.

>> COMMISSIONERS? QUESTIONS FROM MR. COLEMAN? MR. BROUNOFF.

>> QUESTIONS. IN ADDITION TO ALL THE THINGS THAT YOU JUST LISTED.

YOU ALSO HAD TO GET THE PROJECTS TO REWRITE THE ZONING ORDINANCE AND THE SUBDIVISION ORDINANCE UNDERWAY.

YOU HAD TO MOVE THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETINGS FROM THE COUNCIL CHAMBER OVER TO THE DAVIS LIBRARY IN APRIL, AND THEN BACK AGAIN IN NOVEMBER BECAUSE THIS SPACE HAD TO BE RENOVATED.

WE HAD TO REVIEW POSSIBLE UPDATES TO TWO PILLARS OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

WE HAD TO LOOK AT AREA PLANS FOR TWO SILVER LINE STATIONS.

YOU HAD TO GET ALL OF THAT ACCOMPLISHED DESPITE SERIOUS STAFF SHORTAGES LAST YEAR, WHICH WERE THE RESULT OF DEPARTURES OF STAFF AND COMBINED WITH A HIRING FREEZE.

I SALUTE THE STAFF FOR ACCOMPLISHING AS MUCH AS YOU DID LAST YEAR, AND I APPRECIATE YOUR EFFORTS.

I'M SURE YOU'RE RELIEVED, AND WE'RE ALL RELIEVED THAT YOU'RE ABLE TO FILL THE RANKS AGAIN NOW AND OPERATE WITH A FULL CREW.

ANYWAY, CONGRATULATIONS AND THANK YOU FOR ALL YOUR HARD WORK.

>> THANKS, SIR.

>> I MAKE THIS JOKE EVERY YEAR THAT YOU GUYS NEED TO COME TEACH MY ANALYST HOW TO PUT TOGETHER A PITCH DECK.

YOUR DECK WORK IS EXQUISITE.

I'M SURE YOU ALL I'M CONCERNED OBVIOUSLY BY THE LACK OF A PIPELINE FOR SCHOOL AGED KIDS COMING INTO PLANO.

IT FEELS LIKE THAT IS ACCELERATING THE MATURITY OF THE CITY AND POSSIBLY THE DECLINE OF THE CITY? ARE THERE ANY INITIATIVES THAT YOU EITHER HAVE ON YOUR ROADMAP, AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY WOULD BE THAT COULD POSSIBLY BE TARGETED TOWARDS SOLVING THAT GAP THAT YOU'RE SHOWING FROM YOUNG FAMILIES MOVING INTO THE CITY? IS THERE ANYTHING WE NEED TO BE LOOKING AT AS A COMMISSION THAT WE CAN EXPECT TO SEE IN THE NEXT COUPLE OF MONTHS THAT YOU CAN THINK OF THAT WOULD BE SPECIFICALLY TO ADDRESS.

AGAIN, WE DO A GOOD JOB OF MARKETING PLANO AS A BUSINESS FRIENDLY CLIMATE.

I DON'T KNOW IF WE'RE DOING A GOOD ENOUGH JOB OF POSITIONING AND MARKETING PLANO AS A FAMILY FRIENDLY CLIMATE.

IT'S A LITTLE BIT OF A COMMENT QUESTION.

I DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU GO FROM THERE.

>> I THINK IT'S A BIG PROBLEM TO TRY TO SOLVE.

THERE'S LARGE DEMOGRAPHIC TRENDS TO CONTEND WITH.

AGING IN PLACE IS A SIGNIFICANT ISSUE.

I THINK WE'RE ALL AWARE OF.

IT'S DIFFICULT TO KNOW WHAT PANACEA TO OFFER FOR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

[02:20:06]

HOUSING AFFORDABILITY IS AN ISSUE, AND IT HAS BEEN FOR SOME TIME.

WITH THOSE BARRIERS TO ENTRY FOR YOUNG FAMILIES.

IT'S HARD TO KNOW WHAT OPTIONS TO OFFER TO COUNTERACT IT.

ASSISTANT DIRECTOR THAT?

>> JUST TO YOUR POINT SPECIFICALLY ABOUT THE MARKETING PIECE.

WHEN WE MET WITH PLANO ISD, A WEEK AND A HALF AGO AT THE ANNUAL EDUCATION MEETING, THEY MENTIONED A MARKETING PROGRAM SPECIFICALLY INTENDED TO MARKET ITSELF AS A GREAT PLACE TO RAISE A FAMILY AND GET AN EDUCATION.

I THINK THEY ARE CONSIDERING THAT MARKETING PIECE.

>> THAT'S GOOD TO HEAR. THAT WAS THE PRIMARY REASON WHY WE MOVED TO PLANO.

IT PAINS MY HEART THAT THAT'S NOT MORE WIDELY SCREAMED FROM THE ROOFTOP.

ONE QUESTION I HAD ON THE FUTURE HOUSING TYPE, THE PENDING UNITS FOR SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED, AM I READING THAT CORRECTLY TO SAY, WE EXPECT TO BUILD OR HAVE PERMITTED AN EXTRA 229 SINGLE FAMILY HOUSES, AND IF SO, WHERE ARE WE PUTTING THOSE?

>> YES, SIR, 229, THE TRADITIONAL SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED.

THAT BE AN INFILL REDEVELOPMENT TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION.

>> I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ENOUGH UNDEVELOPED LAND FOR THAT.

>> ON PAGE 32, THERE ARE RELATIVELY SMALL DEVELOPMENTS.

IT'S THIS ACTIVE RESIDENTIAL AREA SUMMARY.

IT'S NUMBERS 1-10.

I THINK THE LARGEST PROJECT HAS 107 UNITS.

THAT'S HERITAGE ESTATES, AND IT'S ALMOST BUILT OUT.

MOST ARE 30, 40, 50 UNITS AT A TIME.

>> THERE ARE ALSO A LARGE NUMBER OF THOSE UNITS IN THE COLLIN CREEK DEVELOPMENT, WHICH IS UNDERWAY RIGHT NOW.

>> GOT YOU.

>> COLLIN CREEK DEVELOPMENT, THAT'S ACTUALLY IN THE MIXED USE SINGLE FAMILY TYPE.

>> I WANT TO START OUT BY SAYING, THIS IS TERRIFIC.

>> COMMISSIONER BRONSKY.

YOU GUYS DO A GREAT JOB AT THIS EVERY YEAR, AND I SINCERELY APPRECIATE FROM A RESIDENT'S VIEWPOINT AS WELL AS A COMMISSIONER'S VIEWPOINT, THE EFFORT THAT YOU GO INTO EVERY YEAR TO MAKE SURE THAT WE UNDERSTAND WHAT'S GOING ON AND WHAT'S COMING FORWARD.

I REALLY VALUE THAT, AND I APPRECIATE THAT A LOT.

I'VE GOT A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS ABOUT SOME OF THE INFORMATION.

ON PAGE 12, WHERE IT TALKED ABOUT THE PROJECT SUBMITTALS.

I NOTICE YOU MENTIONED THAT THIS YEAR IT WAS 688, AND IN A PRE COVID ENVIRONMENT, WE WERE OUR NUMBERS WERE ALL EXCEPT FOR 2015, WELL NORTH OF 7,800.

DO WE EXPECT IN A POST COVID ENVIRONMENT FOR THESE NUMBERS TO CONTINUE TO SEE A DECLINE IN PROJECT SUBMITTALS, LONG TERM, OR DO YOU HAVE ANY WAY TO ESTIMATE WHAT YOUR EXPECTATIONS ARE FOR THOSE?

>> I THINK THEY'VE BEEN CONSISTENT OVER THE PAST FEW YEARS, SO THAT MIGHT JUST BE A NEW NORMAL.

LONG TERM, I CAN'T SAY.

>> I THINK WE SAW A BOOM IN THE MARKET IN THE LATER PART OF THE 2010S THAT LED TO THAT SPIKE.

SINCE THAT TIME, IT'S BEEN PRETTY CONSISTENT IN LEVEL.

WE DON'T SEE THAT SLOWING AT ANY SPECIFIC POINT RIGHT NOW.

NOW SIGNIFICANT MARKET SHIFTS COULD OBVIOUSLY AFFECT THAT, BUT AS OF THIS MOMENT, IT SEEMS TO BE PRETTY STEADY.

>> WHEN WE TALK ABOUT SIGNIFICANT MARKET SHIFTS, THAT'S THE NEXT POINT I WAS GOING TO ASK ABOUT, AND THAT IS WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT THAT POPULATION GOING FROM 298 TO ABOUT 310, AND WE LOOK AT THE DEMOGRAPHICS THAT YOU PROVIDE FROM THE SCHOOL DISTRICT, WHICH YOU CAN SEE.

PLANO IS ACCELERATING FASTER THAN THE COUNTY, THE STATE, OR THE UNITED STATES AS A WHOLE, IN THE LACK OF YOUNG PEOPLE MOVING INTO PLANO, YOUNG KINDERGARTNERS, I GUESS, UNDER 10.

THAT ADDITION IN POPULATION, I GUESS WE'RE ANTICIPATING THAT NUMBER TO CONTINUE TO BE NON SCHOOL AGE CHILDREN.

>> LARGELY, YES.

THE INCREASE IS BASED SOLELY ON THE INCREASE IN HOUSING.

[02:25:03]

LIKE WE'RE LARGELY AT A POINT WHERE OUR POPULATION GROWTH IS BASED REALLY ON AN INCREASE IN HOUSING UNITS INSTEAD OF NATURAL MIGRATION.

>> GENERALLY, WE SEE A SMALLER INCREASE IN POPULATION, ESPECIALLY FOR YOUNG PEOPLE IN MULTIFAMILY AS OPPOSED TO SINGLE FAMILY, IS THAT CORRECT?

>> IN THE CHILD POPULATION IN MULTIFAMILY?

>> YES.

>> I DON'T ACTUALLY KNOW.

CERTAIN MULTIFAMILY ARE HIGHER AND HAVE STAYED CONSISTENT.

THERE'S BEEN A SLIGHT DECREASE IN THE PERSONS PER HOUSEHOLD IN, SAY, A TRADITIONAL SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED.

BUT AS FAR AS THE CHILD POPULATION WITHIN THOSE HOUSING TYPES, I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT.

>> I APPRECIATE, COMMISSIONER OLLEY'S WONDERING.

I KNOW JUST A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO, PLANO WAS ACTUALLY RECOGNIZED NATIONALLY AS ONE OF THE BEST PLACES TO RAISE A FAMILY.

I'D LOVE TO HAVE US BE PROMOTING THAT MORE.

BUT I HAVE CONCERN ABOUT WHAT THE AGING IN PLACE IS GOING TO BE A LONG TERM IMPACT ON THE CITIZENRY AS WELL AS IF WE CONTINUE TO SEE AN ACCELERATION OF THE GRAYING IN PLACE OR THE REDUCTIONS IN SCHOOL AGE CHILDREN, THE LONG TERM IMPACT THAT'S GOING TO ACTUALLY HAVE ON WHAT WE'RE ABLE TO PROVIDE AS A CITY AND BE A DESTINATION LOCATION FOR FAMILIES TO MOVE TO.

DO WE THINK THAT BECAUSE THAT NUMBER IS CONTINUING TO DECLINE AT AN ACCELERATED PACE, THAT IT'S GOING TO BASICALLY PRODUCE EVEN MORE OF AN ACCELERATION.

>> I THINK THE TREND IS ANTICIPATED TO CONTINUE AT AN ACCELERATED PACE, IT'S HARD TO SAY HOW FAST IT WILL INCREASE AT A STATE WIDE LEVEL, IT'S PREDICTED TO INCREASE, BUT IT'S DIFFICULT TO KNOW HOW LONG EXACTLY IT WILL LAST.

>> I GUESS MY REAL QUESTION IS, AS WE LOOK TO THE FUTURE, WHAT IS GOING TO BE THE TRUE IMPACT TO THE CITY OF THAT CONTINUED ACCELERATION OF THE DECREASE AND THE NUMBER OF CHILDREN AND THE INCREASED NEED THAT OLDER POPULATIONS ARE GOING TO PROVIDE, I GUESS IS THE BEST WORD I CAN USE FOR IT.

WHAT'S THAT GOING TO CAUSE AND PRODUCE?

>> THERE ARE A FEW DOWNSTREAM THINGS.

THERE ARE TAX EXEMPTIONS FOR OVER 65, SO THERE'S A REDUCTION IN PROPERTY TAX REVENUE.

THERE'S A CHANGE IN THE SERVICE NEEDS WITH AN AGING POPULATION.

>> GENERALLY, THE AGING POPULATION NEEDS MORE SERVICE.

>> NEEDS MORE SERVICES.

IT COULD INCLUDE THINGS LIKE RECREATION PROGRAMMING, THINGS LIKE THAT.

IT'S NOT NECESSARILY EMERGENCY SERVICES, THINGS LIKE THAT, ALTHOUGH IT IS.

>> I DON'T KNOW ALL OF THE IMPACTS THAT WILL RIPPLE OUT FROM THAT, BUT I THINK THOSE ARE THE ONES THAT SPRING TO MIND.

>> I SHARE THAT CONCERN.

LASTLY, WHEN I LOOK AT A LOT OF THE MULTIFAMILY THAT WE'RE BRINGING IN AND THAT WE'VE GOT APPROVED, AND I CONSIDER A LOT OF THOSE ARE ONE OR TWO BEDROOM UNITS LARGELY.

I THINK IT'S GOING TO PRODUCE LESS POSSIBILITY FOR THOSE FAMILIES TO BE.

>> I WOULD SAY THAT WE HAVE NUMBERS ON STUDENTS GENERATED PER UNIT.

AS A PER-UNIT BASIS, THE MIXED-USE MULTIFAMILY AND SINGLE-FAMILY PRODUCE LESS, BUT ON A PER-ACRE BASIS, THEY'RE ACTUALLY PRETTY COMPARABLE BECAUSE WE HAVE JUST MORE DENSITY IN A SMALLER AREA.

THOSE NUMBERS ARE ACTUALLY IN THE REPORT.

I APOLOGIZE ON THE PAGE IN FRONT OF ME, BUT IF YOU GO TO THE SCHOOL DISTRICT INFORMATION, THERE IS AN ESTIMATION OF STUDENTS PER UNIT AND STUDENTS PER ACRE FOR EACH TYPE OF HOUSING.

[02:30:07]

>> IT'S PAGE NUMBER 26.

>> I WISH WE HAD SOME ANSWERS AS FAR AS WHAT WE NEED TO DO OR WHAT WE SHOULD BE LOOKING AT TO CURB THE PROGRESSION THAT WE'RE SEEING IN IT, BUT I GUESS I'LL JUST FINISH BY SAYING, I APPRECIATE THAT YOU GUYS ARE ILLUMINATING THIS TO US, AND I HOPE THAT WHOMEVER IS LOOKING AT THESE NUMBERS ARE FINDING WAYS THAT MAYBE WE CAN AUGMENT OR MAKE SOME CHANGES TO MAYBE ADJUST FOR THE ACCELERATION AND MAYBE FIND WAYS TO CORRECT THAT.

BUT I APPRECIATE THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT BRINGING THIS FORWARD AND CONTINUING TO PRESENT IT TO US SO THAT IT'S FRONT OF MIND FOR OUR COUNCIL, AS WELL AS FOR OUR COMMISSION IN UNDERSTANDING WHAT WE'RE APPROVING. THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU. MR. BROUNOFF.

>> THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. ON THE ONE HAND, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A GRAYING POPULATION DECLINE IN PROJECTED SCHOOL ENROLLMENT.

IF THAT'S ALL THERE WERE, THEN YOU WOULD EXPECT, I THINK THE POPULATION TO DECREASE OVER TIME AS PEOPLE GET OLDER, AND PERHAPS THERE ARE MORE DEATHS THAN PEOPLE COMING INTO THE CITY.

YET, YOU'RE ALSO FORECASTING A POPULATION INCREASE OF 298,000 TO 316,000.

I'M WONDERING WHAT DEMOGRAPHIC GROUPS WOULD MAKE UP THE PROJECTED POPULATION INCREASE IN TERMS OF AGE, IN TERMS OF INCOME LEVEL, IN TERMS OF OCCUPATION, BLUE COLLAR, WHITE COLLAR WHAT? FAMILIES, SINGLE PEOPLE, RETIREES? WHAT?

>> THIS IS JUST SPECULATION.

I THINK A LOT OF THE HOUSING UNITS THAT WE HAVE PROJECTED, IF YOU LOOK AT THE NUMBERS, A LOT OF MID-RISE MULTIFAMILY, A LOT OF UNITS THAT ARE COMING IN IN MIXED-USE SCENARIOS.

I WOULD ANTICIPATE THAT IT WOULD BE A LOT OF YOUNG PROFESSIONALS 20S, 30S, THAT AGE COHORT.

BUT WE HAVE, I DON'T KNOW THE NUMBER RIGHT OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD, 01,693 INDEPENDENT LIVING UNITS THAT ARE ALSO PROJECTED.

THERE WILL ALSO BE THE POTENTIAL THAT THERE'S HOUSING AVAILABLE FOR PEOPLE WHO MAYBE WANT TO MOVE OUT OF THEIR HOME TO AN INDEPENDENT LIVING SITUATION.

>> I'M NOT ASKING ABOUT UNITS. I'M ASKING ABOUT PEOPLE.

WHERE IS THE POPULATION INCREASE GOING TO COME FROM?

>> THE INCREASE IS COMING FROM THE PENDING NUMBER OF UNITS THAT HAVE BEEN APPROVED AND NOT YET BUILT.

>> IT'S BASED ONLY UPON UNITS.

>> OUR VARIABLES ARE THE NUMBER OF PENDING UNITS, THE NUMBER OF PERSONS PER HOUSEHOLD, WHICH VARIES AND IS DIFFERENT BY EACH HOUSING TYPE, AND THEN OCCUPANCY OR VACANCY RATES, WHICH ALSO FLUCTUATES.

THOSE ARE THE THREE MAIN DRIVERS OF OUR POPULATION ESTIMATES.

THERE ARE OTHERS, IMMIGRATION AND OUT MIGRATION.

BUT THOSE ARE THE THREE MAIN FACTORS, AND WE COMPARE THOSE WITH THE ESTIMATES OF THE COUNCIL OF GOVERNMENTS AS WELL AS THE CENSUS BUREAU TO COMPARE NOTES.

>> THAT ASSUMES THAT ALL OR MOST OF THE PROJECTED UNITS ARE GOING TO BE FILLED?

>> IT'S ASSUMING THE CURRENT OCCUPANCY RATES OF EACH INDIVIDUAL HOUSING TYPE, WHICH WE DERIVE FROM THE CENSUS DATA.

>> SORRY. GO AHEAD.

>> NO. YOU'RE NOT PLANNING FOR X NUMBER OF UNITS OF VARIOUS TYPES TO MATCH A PROJECTED POPULATION INCREASE.

IT'S THE REVERSE. YOU'RE CALCULATING POPULATION INCREASE BASED UPON APPROVED UNITS.

>> YES, SIR.